I know this direction was pretty much unavoidable, but man I hate when protagonists just don’t communicate haha. I don’t want Ethan to go through an emo phase because they kept him out of the loop (understandably so).
Still following along though! It’s still an engaging story, and I hope everyone can come to a decent reconciliation sooner than later.
I’ve been watching Stitchers with my girlfriend recently and last night what easily could’ve been a horrible mopey thing dragging on for episodes was resolved in about four sentences because the characters communicated.
When and how much dialogue should be written all depend on your character’s communicative needs. Ethan and Lucas are extroverts with multiple partnerships (superhero, roommates, business partners) that require more communication. Scott is more introverted from his intense physical and emotional losses. This kind of screw up was bound to happen eventually.
What’s fun is when the decision to communicate backfires. Imagine telling this exact story a different way: They DO tell Ethan, and Ethan, in a moment of ill-conceived trustworthiness, tells Zeke. And then Zeke uses that information to escape, and becomes a major villain of the arc as he works to reproduce himself.
I mean I would have just told Zeke himself. Look robot you have tried to kill us on more than one occasion. I do not trust you. But Ethan for some reason does and is willing to seek redemption for you. So we are not going to destroy you however your kill switch IS on and is triggered for when you try and leave this room. So for now stay put and show me what he sees in you.
That wouldn’t work, because that way the robot obeys under duress, the same way they obeyed Master. So there is no way here to earn robot’s trust and to educate the robot
Thing is, communication wouldn’t have helped this one. Lucas and Scott were right – Ethan couldn’t have kept a secret. Even if he learned later. Without trust, Zeke wouldn’t have opened up. And Zeke wasn’t going to live without Scott’s confidence that all was under control. It’s easy to say “gee if only the characters actually communicated!” but real life people lie and deceive each other for a reason, and it’s not just so the plot can continue. It’s to get our way. Sometimes with the best of intentions. To say “gee, if only they communicated” is to say “gee,… Read more »
The problem is when the lack of communication is uncharacteristic. I don’t think that’s the case here. They didn’t communicate because of clear reasons.
But in many stories, people who would usually tell the others stuff, suddenly withhold some important detail for no other reason than “So the story can happen”.
Not to redirect traffic, but the comic Aurora is written and made by the creators of the YouTube channel OverlySarcasticProductions, so you know all the tropes are either avoided or well integrated so you can’t really even complain about their inclusion.
Including the main cast communicating.
I don’t think it’s fair to think they aren’t communicating yet, Scott made his case for his reasoning why he was so antagonistic to the idea of ZK and Lucas hasn’t even responded yet.
The fact of the matter this isn’t one of those misunderstandings where if all parties had all info they would all agee.
Scott has always and still wants to destroy ZK. Ethan doesn’t. Lucas believed ZK was too dangerous to let loose in the city and that his promise didn’t mean much to stay in the stockroom. These positions were and still incompatible with Ethan’s beliefs.
Ethan was fine with every restriction except the bomb, and frankly Ethan the only one who’s been right here so far. I get why Scott and Lucas wouldn’t think that to be true, both from experience with Ethan’s impulsiveness, and an outsiders view of Zeke’s behavior, but we as the readers know that Ethan is correct. Zeke is sentient and deserves the rights of other sentient beings.
Scott fucked up because he acted unilaterally and in direct contravention to what the group decided together.
Scott decided to act unilaterally and leave an active bomb in the head of a sentient being, and what it has to do with not communicating is that he concealed that fact, wholly or partially, from both Ethan and Lucas. The problem for Ethan and Lucas is that the lie Scott told Lucas persuaded him to conceal what Lucas thought was the actual situation from Ethan. So there’s one lie by Scott that persuaded Lucas to lie to Ethan, and another lie by Scott that led to Zeke’s apparent death due to Ethan being lied to about the bomb’s existence,… Read more »
Hunter
2 years ago
Arguments about whose right aside, Ethan does have a legit reason to be angry.
His best friend and his almost brother in law lied and kept him in the dark.
You could argue that they were right that Ethan wouldn’t listen but Ethan’s not a child despite his immaturity. Hiding this from him has led us to this moment.
Plus Scott compounded the problem when he lied and said “He’d take care of it”
Could see a very dramatic break up, at least in the short term here.
The problem is Scott didn’t lie. He just twisted the truth. Unfortunately, if you’re good with words, it’s pretty easy to use someone else’s interpretation of the truth into your truth where neither told a lie. This was a prime example of it, but it also shows the consequences.
That relies on a very narrow definition of lying, and even then it’s not fully correct. Because he said they ‘don’t need to worry about it’, and Ethan obviously did need to worry about it. But he also intentionally made Ethan believe something that he didn’t mean, which is part of the broader definition of lying which is saying something with the intent to deceive. Twisting the truth is always lying except by the most narrow ‘said a false statement’ definition.
“Twisting the truth” is also called lying. Scott 100% lied. Knowing that Lucas will interpret “you don’t have to worry about it anymore” as “I will disarm the bomb” when you have no intention of disarming it makes it a lie.
Yeah, I can tell your right now, that is considered lying for the vast majority of people in the world. Partial truths can be just as damaging as full out lies, perhaps even more so.
There is literally no difference between lying with a straight-up lie or with “twisted truth”.
If you say, “Eating rat poison won’t kill you”, but you mean “it will not kill you within seconds”, then it doesn’t matter, that there might exist an interpretation where your words can be twisted to be logically true.
It’s weird that you say “the problem is” and “Unfortunately.” As if the liar gains something by not telling a technical lie, but instead deceiving and manipulating others by clever wordplay.
If you’re in some sort of a relationship (friendship, family, romantic, whatever) where someone is getting a pass by not technically lying, that’s a toxic relationship. At best, you need to confront the person on their BS. At worst, you need to get out.
What is interesting is how culpable Lucas is. It’s clear that Scott wanted ZK destroyed from moment one and he still considers this event a relief. Should Lucas have noticed this about Scott? Should he have realized, like the readership, Scott’s noncommittal “ill take care of it” was worth investigating? Also this brings to a head Lucas’ treatment of Ethan. They’re going to confront now that Lucas thinks Ethan is too immature to appropriately handle some decisions and he keeps info from him. And you know, in some ways he’s justified for that. Ethan doesn’t need to worry about getting… Read more »
It’s like when my mother used to steal my beer out of my refrigerator (I rented the basement of her house for a few years). I got mad at her for taking my shit i paid for without asking. She responded with “Well if I asked you, you would’ve said no!”
Going behind someone’s back so they can’t object to what you’re doing doesn’t make it any better.
I think angry only begins to describe it. Ethan invited ZK to leave the stockroom. I suspect he’s going to be hit with the guilt of being directly responsible (practically, not morally) with murdering ZK. Then not only will Ethan blame Scott and Lucas for ZK’s death, but for making him part of it. Lying is one thing, but how do you ever forgive someone for putting you in a position where you then are responsible for someone’s death?
JustAHandle
2 years ago
My personal theory is ZK is hearing all of this discussion, similar to how they initially deactivated him. For example, the bomb was rigged just to disable him, not destroy him because The Master knew that he would be unable to recreate him, but could still punish and recover him.
No one knows yet. In the case of cancer, it’s a possibility that he dies from it but is resurrected without it. Old age, though…that sounds like game over.
In hiding Analog – Ethan uses the specs he has to (secretly?) repair ZK, who turns out to have protected the majority of his awareness and personality by storing in partitions other than his “head”.
ZK understands that Ethan was blameless and clueless in the whole situation so they both end up in a safehouse of sorts somewhere, while Ethan tries to help ZK grow up good, and ZK quietly plots revenge on Scott…
Ya, I’ve wondered if at a certain age will he stop getting checkpoints and always re-spawn at that particular one because that is his last “healthy” point.
We, the reader, are aware. Not to mention that we can take our time to digest and analyse a moment overa longer period of time, which lasted mere seconds for the characters.
That said, from Ethan’s perspective, he was talking to Zeke, Lucas shouted something, then the back of Zeke’s head exploded.
Scott told Lucas what his plan was with the fail-safe so Lucas was aware, though it is of course possible that he had forgotten, since he’s only a regular old super-human.
Lucas told Scott he didn’t think it neded to be active anymore and Scott told Lucas he “Didn’t need to worry about it anymore” Lucas assumed that meant the bomb was deactivated until he saw Scotts face as Zeke left the storeroom.
But Lucas came to Scott asking him to disable the bomb, and Scott lied by omission right to his face. “I’ll take care of it. You don’t need to worry about it anymore.” That implies to Lucas (who trusts Scott) that Scott will do as he asks.
Lucas knew that the bomb had been set to proximity mode when Scott first did it. Later on, he decided Ethan was right, Zeke was not a threat, and the bomb could be switched off. He told Scott to turn it off and assumed Scotts saying it would be “taken care of” to mean he did so.
Lucas isn’t wholly blameless here, he did hide the initial fact of the bomb from Ethan, but he thought Scott had turned it off and didn’t realize the bomb was still active until he saw Scott’s face right before Zeke left the storeroom.
Lucas knew the failsafe was still there in the first place, though. That’s why he knew when he saw Scott’s face that Scott had lied to him and that he should try to warn ZK.
Lucas isn’t guilty in the bomb still being active after he asked it to be deactivated, but he’s guilty in keeping it active in the first place.
Daniel Pereira
2 years ago
So nice to see a lot of points touched upon the comments section to be answered in the comic! Well done! Just a piece of info, do with it what you will: An AI incapable of free will is going to be _much_ faster in parsing data and choosing an appropriate reaction than an AI with it. Machines that follow a prime directive do not waste CPU cycles thinking how they should feel about a course of action before taking said action. Even if non-sapient AIs were to have slightly inferior hardware, they would probably still be faster to execute.… Read more »
Tarik
2 years ago
Love the story. Curious to see if they make Scott a villain again.
I’m seeing the same thing I tell my kids, the truth or better way is somewhere in the middle. Somewhere between blind trust and blind hate.
Joel
2 years ago
Did I miss something? If Lucas was in on it and tried to warn ZK, then why would he have been all “Wtf Scott”? If he knew the bomb was still active, then there would be nothing to be mad at Scott about. If he thought Scott deactivated the bomb, there would be nothing to warn ZK about.
I guess I’m in my own “A Few Good Men” paradox. Why the 2 orders Colonel Jessup?
Lucas told Scott he didn’t think it neded to be active anymore and Scott told Lucas he “Didn’t need to worry about it anymore” Lucas assumed that meant the bomb was deactivated until he saw Scotts face as Zeke left the storeroom.
Lucas thought the bomb was disabled, but then saw Scott’s reaction to Zeke leaving the room and realized that Scott did not disable it, thus prompting his attempt to warn Zeke.
Lucas was aware of the failsafe, but he asked Scott to disable it because he felt Zeke proven himself enough to have it disabled. Scott answered noncommittedly that he would take care of it giving the impression he would go along with what Lucas was saying about the failsafe but didn’t.
HelloWorld
2 years ago
Lucas has a better argument than Scott. They saw Zeke as a threat (based on him attacking people) and allowed the freedom of choice to stay or to leave. If he left, they would be responsible for Zeke’s death toll afterwards, so the bomb safety net was acceptable when there was no trust. After a few weeks/months, Lucas requested the safety net to be extended to a larger zone (I think it was city-wide, but not sure) and was told he need not worry about it. Lucas only realized it had not been done when he saw Scott’s reaction just… Read more »
I think he wanted it extended to the whole store.”Tho I have to go back and look”. I believe it was just after ZK almost went out into the store and Lucas realized that just the back room was to small and might cause something like this to happen.
https://cad-comic.com/comic/identity-p21/
He didn’t explicitly say how far he wanted it expanded, just “expanded.” Scott said he’ll take care of it and that Lucas didn’t need to worry about it anymore. Basically, he was already planning on letting this happen for the greater good as he sees it.
GUNnibal
2 years ago
Oooh, the first super ever registered? I wonder if they are still around – 70 years is a long time but not beyond normal human life span.
Add about 20-30 years to assume they were an adult when it happened and you get close, but also depending on power they might have a longer lifespan. But also they’re much more likely to die from non-age-related things.
If it was ANYONE else, yeah maybe. But Scott and Lucas are pretty much family to Ethan, so I can’t see him pulling a Zeke on them. After this, though, things are gonna be frosty between them for sure. I just hope this doesn’t lead to Ethan going rogue.
What I meant was less deadly and more “I wanna punch this guy.” But yeah, maybe the family sentiment is helping Ethan stay just under boiling.
DontBeThatGuy
2 years ago
Ok, before I was worried Scott would separate as a sort of anti-hero because of this. Now? Well, I’m relieved it doesn’t look that way, but now it’s looking like Ethan might instead. Even if he won’t, this is still not good…
Esc
2 years ago
It’s really the perfect way to make a rift between Ethan and Lucas. Scott’s deception compounds Lucas’ initial denial of the full truth to Ethan. He didn’t tell him about the perimeter bomb. BUT he did tell Scott to turn it off quickly and thought the matter was done with. I’m sure Ethan in his current state won’t think that distinction as good enough. Because it gave cover for Scott to do this. I can see Ethan listening and needing time to forgive Lucas. And maybe an act of contrition to restore Zeke will make it right. But I don’t… Read more »
Scott (but not the bad one in the story)
2 years ago
Has anybody else noticed that ZK is now being referred to as Zeke?
He was already being referenced as Zeke right after he chose ZK. Ethan was coming up with monikers, said “Zeke,” to which Zeke replied “I’ll allow it.”
I wonder how much this robot is similar to the android from the world of Wild Cards.
Jon
2 years ago
I don’t get why Ethan is accepting Scott’s logic so readily. They are in a world of super powered people – every day there are probably new threats and problems. The idea that an AI that can’t propagate itself exists seems like it is just par for the course. Much like finding a new super powered person – Zeke is basically just a new super powered person with the power to be an electronic life form. I think Ethan should be replying to Scott that he’s just a paranoid ass who is so afraid of even potential change and his… Read more »
West
2 years ago
Game Haven is going to be full of awkward silences for a few weeks.
Drew
2 years ago
And a Supervillain is born!
Mr. Casual
2 years ago
This so-called machine was attaining sentience like nothing else before them. They should’ve at least have had a say in what happens to them. Scott shouldn’t be the sole arbiter of their fate, and to put himself in that position sparks of hubris. It’s also an incredible betrayal of trust.
Eldest Gruff
2 years ago
Wow. Dominoes are falling kind of where I expected. So prediction time, I guess. 20% chance, all three think that Zeke is gone for good. If so, 70% chance Ethan ‘splits the party’ by firing Scott, and maybe 50/50 on Lucas firing/eviction. 30% chance for grudging acceptance. 80% chance that they think that Zeke is salvageable, either from the main memory not being as damaged as they thought, or Scott or Z having a sneaky memory dump. If so, 70% chance that Scott reconciles by attempting to fix his mistake, and 30% chance that he refuses, prompting Ethan to yank… Read more »
Firing Scott is inevitable, he betrayed their thrust, after saying he trusted Lucas. Scott will become an Anti-hero, and probably make his own robot army to fight the Master and other heroes he disagrees with. Probably splitting after Ethan Mentions he’s glad his sister never learned what kind of person Scott really is. and that Scott is unworthy to have ever dated his sister. Ethan and Lucas will talk about what happened, and that Lucas while at fault for allowing the bomb to still be active, did think it was deactivated after ZK took a name, and he talked to… Read more »
Eldest Gruff
2 years ago
Also, yay for awesome sneaky lore insert!
Mr_Meng
2 years ago
Ethan looks at ZK and sees Johnny 5.
Scott looks at ZK and sees Ultron.
The real problem is that they’re both right and neither one is willing to really see things from the other’s perspective.
ThatMageGuy
2 years ago
If anime has taught me anything, it’s that Ethan is going to learn new, insanely powerful aspects to his power now, and they’ll be powerless against the next the next boss guy.
Blue Griffin
2 years ago
So strange so see Ethan’s sideburns. Also very impressive attention to detail for Ethan, but I guess this is the bit more focused version than the original comic one.
Del Cox
2 years ago
Maybe this is where Ethan fixes Zeke and ties together with the old continuity where he built Zeke in the first place with no idea how he accomplished it.
Maybe not the best plot device, but eh.
John Swift
2 years ago
A good talk, wow. Also I like the Elden Ring banner. I like how you just run with the real world video game releases here.
Atvaark
2 years ago
The Elden Ring poster framed behind Lucas is a pretty nice touch. Tarnished indeed.
Rolando
2 years ago
Called it. Ethan is using the arguments I presented in the previous strip’s comments.
And Scott continues to make the same mistake I mentioned, of course. Short-sightedness.
Contain it? You just can’t. And it ALWAYS backfires, when you try to “contain” the different. Especially since what you call “containment,” the different rightfully call imprisonment/torture/abuse/genocide/etc.
montaillou
2 years ago
Zeke’s not an idiot, he’s just friends with one. I’m sure he made/backed up a copy of himself on a toaster or something.
austindorf
2 years ago
Scott is trying to razionalize and has some reason, but it’s basically racist. He want to destroy zeke anyway because they’re a new species. He is wrong. He is like some umanity in the x-men comics, he fear zeke not because it’s a murder machine, but because it exist. And it’s a point of view that can easy became villany, it isn’t really different from the master.
Dagroth
2 years ago
“Chapter 8: The Breaking of the Fellowship” ?
Woodrobin
2 years ago
In terms of super-beings you should worry about pissing off, the serially-respawning virtual immortal might be fairly high on your list. Killing his friend? Bad idea. Refusing to refer to his friend as a person while trying to paint yourself as a world-saving hero for killing said friend: Really bad idea. I’m trying to remember whether he lied to the other super about disabling the bomb entirely, or just lied about expanding the geofencing on the bomb to encompass the whole store (never mind that Zeke could have embezzled billions of dollars without moving an inch, amongst other cyber-crimes he… Read more »
lechuckGL
2 years ago
From BatEthan to PunishEthan ?
Jon
2 years ago
Probably gonna get blasted for this, but..
Scott was the only one thinking rationally. Just because Zeke was behaving, didn’t make him any less of a threat to the human race. And more so, Zeke is a super-intelligent android. Who’s to say he wasn’t playing them all? Stating that it amused him once he inevitably betrayed them?
A gun with a conscience is still a gun, after all. And again, if anyone got their hands on Zeke’s schematics, and found a way to copy his programming without his few morals, that’s literally game over for the entire human race.
Thraxas
2 years ago
I really like the game haven scenes always those fun details in some place, like this time the Elden ring poster behind Lucas.
Bummer with Zecke though
Lone wolf Cavalry
2 years ago
Somethings been bugging me is this storyline a prequel, reboot or something else?
Reboot. Same characters, but a completely different world in which they live. In the first comic, Ethan and Lilah meet because they’re both gamers. In this reboot, they meet because of crime in the city, as a super and reporter. The first comic didn’t really have any supernatural stuff except for Zeke.
vaisravana
2 years ago
I get that Scott has his reasons to be wary of robots and all…but it just sucks he did never even stop to *consider* they could actually be sentient. Or maybe cuz it was more convenient not to entertain that thought? Anyway, while I *do* understand the argument of Zeke *potentially* posing a big risk I feel that argument just doesn’t hold water if you think about it. Even with a former killer robot around that may or may not undergo rehabilitation, the biggest risk to humans still would be and for the foreseeable future stay their fellow humans. And… Read more »
24
Aw shit.
Dang it. That was my line
I know this direction was pretty much unavoidable, but man I hate when protagonists just don’t communicate haha. I don’t want Ethan to go through an emo phase because they kept him out of the loop (understandably so).
Still following along though! It’s still an engaging story, and I hope everyone can come to a decent reconciliation sooner than later.
I have often said, if I write a book, the protagonists will communicate with eachother.
As such, the main plot will complete in chapter 5
I’ve been watching Stitchers with my girlfriend recently and last night what easily could’ve been a horrible mopey thing dragging on for episodes was resolved in about four sentences because the characters communicated.
When and how much dialogue should be written all depend on your character’s communicative needs. Ethan and Lucas are extroverts with multiple partnerships (superhero, roommates, business partners) that require more communication. Scott is more introverted from his intense physical and emotional losses. This kind of screw up was bound to happen eventually.
What’s fun is when the decision to communicate backfires. Imagine telling this exact story a different way: They DO tell Ethan, and Ethan, in a moment of ill-conceived trustworthiness, tells Zeke. And then Zeke uses that information to escape, and becomes a major villain of the arc as he works to reproduce himself.
I mean I would have just told Zeke himself. Look robot you have tried to kill us on more than one occasion. I do not trust you. But Ethan for some reason does and is willing to seek redemption for you. So we are not going to destroy you however your kill switch IS on and is triggered for when you try and leave this room. So for now stay put and show me what he sees in you.
That wouldn’t work, because that way the robot obeys under duress, the same way they obeyed Master. So there is no way here to earn robot’s trust and to educate the robot
Thing is, communication wouldn’t have helped this one. Lucas and Scott were right – Ethan couldn’t have kept a secret. Even if he learned later. Without trust, Zeke wouldn’t have opened up. And Zeke wasn’t going to live without Scott’s confidence that all was under control. It’s easy to say “gee if only the characters actually communicated!” but real life people lie and deceive each other for a reason, and it’s not just so the plot can continue. It’s to get our way. Sometimes with the best of intentions. To say “gee, if only they communicated” is to say “gee,… Read more »
The problem is when the lack of communication is uncharacteristic. I don’t think that’s the case here. They didn’t communicate because of clear reasons.
But in many stories, people who would usually tell the others stuff, suddenly withhold some important detail for no other reason than “So the story can happen”.
That is bad writing.
can’t wait for the next thrilling instalment of Sensible Adventures with Reason and Logic
Not to redirect traffic, but the comic Aurora is written and made by the creators of the YouTube channel OverlySarcasticProductions, so you know all the tropes are either avoided or well integrated so you can’t really even complain about their inclusion.
Including the main cast communicating.
I mean, unless the bad guys are real schemers, then it could go on for longer… but yeah, kudos for protagonist communication.
I don’t think it’s fair to think they aren’t communicating yet, Scott made his case for his reasoning why he was so antagonistic to the idea of ZK and Lucas hasn’t even responded yet.
The fact of the matter this isn’t one of those misunderstandings where if all parties had all info they would all agee.
Scott has always and still wants to destroy ZK. Ethan doesn’t. Lucas believed ZK was too dangerous to let loose in the city and that his promise didn’t mean much to stay in the stockroom. These positions were and still incompatible with Ethan’s beliefs.
Ethan was fine with every restriction except the bomb, and frankly Ethan the only one who’s been right here so far. I get why Scott and Lucas wouldn’t think that to be true, both from experience with Ethan’s impulsiveness, and an outsiders view of Zeke’s behavior, but we as the readers know that Ethan is correct. Zeke is sentient and deserves the rights of other sentient beings.
Scott fucked up because he acted unilaterally and in direct contravention to what the group decided together.
I don’t see what that has to do with whether they are or aren’t communicating.
Scott decided to act unilaterally and leave an active bomb in the head of a sentient being, and what it has to do with not communicating is that he concealed that fact, wholly or partially, from both Ethan and Lucas. The problem for Ethan and Lucas is that the lie Scott told Lucas persuaded him to conceal what Lucas thought was the actual situation from Ethan. So there’s one lie by Scott that persuaded Lucas to lie to Ethan, and another lie by Scott that led to Zeke’s apparent death due to Ethan being lied to about the bomb’s existence,… Read more »
Arguments about whose right aside, Ethan does have a legit reason to be angry.
His best friend and his almost brother in law lied and kept him in the dark.
You could argue that they were right that Ethan wouldn’t listen but Ethan’s not a child despite his immaturity. Hiding this from him has led us to this moment.
Plus Scott compounded the problem when he lied and said “He’d take care of it”
Could see a very dramatic break up, at least in the short term here.
The problem is Scott didn’t lie. He just twisted the truth. Unfortunately, if you’re good with words, it’s pretty easy to use someone else’s interpretation of the truth into your truth where neither told a lie. This was a prime example of it, but it also shows the consequences.
That relies on a very narrow definition of lying, and even then it’s not fully correct. Because he said they ‘don’t need to worry about it’, and Ethan obviously did need to worry about it. But he also intentionally made Ethan believe something that he didn’t mean, which is part of the broader definition of lying which is saying something with the intent to deceive. Twisting the truth is always lying except by the most narrow ‘said a false statement’ definition.
Scott for Mayor 2024
“Twisting the truth” is also called lying. Scott 100% lied. Knowing that Lucas will interpret “you don’t have to worry about it anymore” as “I will disarm the bomb” when you have no intention of disarming it makes it a lie.
Yeah, I can tell your right now, that is considered lying for the vast majority of people in the world. Partial truths can be just as damaging as full out lies, perhaps even more so.
There is literally no difference between lying with a straight-up lie or with “twisted truth”.
If you say, “Eating rat poison won’t kill you”, but you mean “it will not kill you within seconds”, then it doesn’t matter, that there might exist an interpretation where your words can be twisted to be logically true.
Captain Picard was very clear when he said that “A lie of omission is still a lie.”
It’s weird that you say “the problem is” and “Unfortunately.” As if the liar gains something by not telling a technical lie, but instead deceiving and manipulating others by clever wordplay.
If you’re in some sort of a relationship (friendship, family, romantic, whatever) where someone is getting a pass by not technically lying, that’s a toxic relationship. At best, you need to confront the person on their BS. At worst, you need to get out.
What is interesting is how culpable Lucas is. It’s clear that Scott wanted ZK destroyed from moment one and he still considers this event a relief. Should Lucas have noticed this about Scott? Should he have realized, like the readership, Scott’s noncommittal “ill take care of it” was worth investigating? Also this brings to a head Lucas’ treatment of Ethan. They’re going to confront now that Lucas thinks Ethan is too immature to appropriately handle some decisions and he keeps info from him. And you know, in some ways he’s justified for that. Ethan doesn’t need to worry about getting… Read more »
It’s like when my mother used to steal my beer out of my refrigerator (I rented the basement of her house for a few years). I got mad at her for taking my shit i paid for without asking. She responded with “Well if I asked you, you would’ve said no!”
Going behind someone’s back so they can’t object to what you’re doing doesn’t make it any better.
I think angry only begins to describe it. Ethan invited ZK to leave the stockroom. I suspect he’s going to be hit with the guilt of being directly responsible (practically, not morally) with murdering ZK. Then not only will Ethan blame Scott and Lucas for ZK’s death, but for making him part of it. Lying is one thing, but how do you ever forgive someone for putting you in a position where you then are responsible for someone’s death?
My personal theory is ZK is hearing all of this discussion, similar to how they initially deactivated him. For example, the bomb was rigged just to disable him, not destroy him because The Master knew that he would be unable to recreate him, but could still punish and recover him.
it was rather small and with his recent part swap out he could have moved vital systems away from it on the chance it had a misfire.
You want to create an immortal bad guy? Because this is how you create a bad guy…
This could very well be the origin story of Evil-Analog…
Does he come back healthy if he dies of like, cancer? Just wondering if he does get older and can die of old age.
No one knows yet. In the case of cancer, it’s a possibility that he dies from it but is resurrected without it. Old age, though…that sounds like game over.
Ethan won’t age the same as everyone else, not if he keeps dying.
All those seconds, minutes and possibly hours add up if his “last healthy state” is the key point.
In hiding Analog – Ethan uses the specs he has to (secretly?) repair ZK, who turns out to have protected the majority of his awareness and personality by storing in partitions other than his “head”.
ZK understands that Ethan was blameless and clueless in the whole situation so they both end up in a safehouse of sorts somewhere, while Ethan tries to help ZK grow up good, and ZK quietly plots revenge on Scott…
Ya, I’ve wondered if at a certain age will he stop getting checkpoints and always re-spawn at that particular one because that is his last “healthy” point.
I think they are creating a bad guy, but its going to be Scott.
Well if history has anything to say… Wonder if they’ll hold guy/girl in the chair auditions.
That’s actually a very interesting thought… /me goes away pondering the ideia 🙂
He would be easy to defeat. It’s a contain, not kill, mission.
Clearly Lucas didn’t know, he saw Scott’s alerted face and guessed what was going on.
We, the reader, are aware. Not to mention that we can take our time to digest and analyse a moment overa longer period of time, which lasted mere seconds for the characters.
That said, from Ethan’s perspective, he was talking to Zeke, Lucas shouted something, then the back of Zeke’s head exploded.
Lucas correctly read Scott………
Scott told Lucas what his plan was with the fail-safe so Lucas was aware, though it is of course possible that he had forgotten, since he’s only a regular old super-human.
https://cad-comic.com/comic/trust-p16/
Lucas told Scott he didn’t think it neded to be active anymore and Scott told Lucas he “Didn’t need to worry about it anymore” Lucas assumed that meant the bomb was deactivated until he saw Scotts face as Zeke left the storeroom.
I forgot about that part as I am just a regular old non-super-human. Lucas is exonerated… sorto of…
But Lucas came to Scott asking him to disable the bomb, and Scott lied by omission right to his face. “I’ll take care of it. You don’t need to worry about it anymore.” That implies to Lucas (who trusts Scott) that Scott will do as he asks.
https://cad-comic.com/comic/identity-p21/
But he was asked to disable it:
https://cad-comic.com/comic/identity-p21
and he agreed to.
Lucas knew that the bomb had been set to proximity mode when Scott first did it. Later on, he decided Ethan was right, Zeke was not a threat, and the bomb could be switched off. He told Scott to turn it off and assumed Scotts saying it would be “taken care of” to mean he did so.
Lucas isn’t wholly blameless here, he did hide the initial fact of the bomb from Ethan, but he thought Scott had turned it off and didn’t realize the bomb was still active until he saw Scott’s face right before Zeke left the storeroom.
Lucas knew the failsafe was still there in the first place, though. That’s why he knew when he saw Scott’s face that Scott had lied to him and that he should try to warn ZK.
Lucas isn’t guilty in the bomb still being active after he asked it to be deactivated, but he’s guilty in keeping it active in the first place.
So nice to see a lot of points touched upon the comments section to be answered in the comic! Well done! Just a piece of info, do with it what you will: An AI incapable of free will is going to be _much_ faster in parsing data and choosing an appropriate reaction than an AI with it. Machines that follow a prime directive do not waste CPU cycles thinking how they should feel about a course of action before taking said action. Even if non-sapient AIs were to have slightly inferior hardware, they would probably still be faster to execute.… Read more »
Love the story. Curious to see if they make Scott a villain again.
I’m seeing the same thing I tell my kids, the truth or better way is somewhere in the middle. Somewhere between blind trust and blind hate.
Did I miss something? If Lucas was in on it and tried to warn ZK, then why would he have been all “Wtf Scott”? If he knew the bomb was still active, then there would be nothing to be mad at Scott about. If he thought Scott deactivated the bomb, there would be nothing to warn ZK about.
I guess I’m in my own “A Few Good Men” paradox. Why the 2 orders Colonel Jessup?
I mean, Ethan’s already upset so we can’t expect him to be fully processing the smaller details.
I’m thinking more along the lines of story continuity and less about a particular character’s attention to it.
Lucas told Scott he didn’t think it neded to be active anymore and Scott told Lucas he “Didn’t need to worry about it anymore” Lucas assumed that meant the bomb was deactivated until he saw Scotts face as Zeke left the storeroom.
here https://cad-comic.com/comic/identity-p21/
Lucas thought the bomb was disabled, but then saw Scott’s reaction to Zeke leaving the room and realized that Scott did not disable it, thus prompting his attempt to warn Zeke.
Lucas was aware of the failsafe, but he asked Scott to disable it because he felt Zeke proven himself enough to have it disabled. Scott answered noncommittedly that he would take care of it giving the impression he would go along with what Lucas was saying about the failsafe but didn’t.
Lucas has a better argument than Scott. They saw Zeke as a threat (based on him attacking people) and allowed the freedom of choice to stay or to leave. If he left, they would be responsible for Zeke’s death toll afterwards, so the bomb safety net was acceptable when there was no trust. After a few weeks/months, Lucas requested the safety net to be extended to a larger zone (I think it was city-wide, but not sure) and was told he need not worry about it. Lucas only realized it had not been done when he saw Scott’s reaction just… Read more »
I think he wanted it extended to the whole store.”Tho I have to go back and look”. I believe it was just after ZK almost went out into the store and Lucas realized that just the back room was to small and might cause something like this to happen.
https://cad-comic.com/comic/identity-p21/
He didn’t explicitly say how far he wanted it expanded, just “expanded.” Scott said he’ll take care of it and that Lucas didn’t need to worry about it anymore. Basically, he was already planning on letting this happen for the greater good as he sees it.
Oooh, the first super ever registered? I wonder if they are still around – 70 years is a long time but not beyond normal human life span.
Add about 20-30 years to assume they were an adult when it happened and you get close, but also depending on power they might have a longer lifespan. But also they’re much more likely to die from non-age-related things.
Virtually all superheroes become superheroes between 14-18.
Is that statement for in general or specific to this comic? Either way, it adds another decade or two to the age the first registered super would be.
I’ll be honest, this is a lot more conversation than I expected. I thought Ethan would be a bit violent toward Scott.
If it was ANYONE else, yeah maybe. But Scott and Lucas are pretty much family to Ethan, so I can’t see him pulling a Zeke on them. After this, though, things are gonna be frosty between them for sure. I just hope this doesn’t lead to Ethan going rogue.
What I meant was less deadly and more “I wanna punch this guy.” But yeah, maybe the family sentiment is helping Ethan stay just under boiling.
Ok, before I was worried Scott would separate as a sort of anti-hero because of this. Now? Well, I’m relieved it doesn’t look that way, but now it’s looking like Ethan might instead. Even if he won’t, this is still not good…
It’s really the perfect way to make a rift between Ethan and Lucas. Scott’s deception compounds Lucas’ initial denial of the full truth to Ethan. He didn’t tell him about the perimeter bomb. BUT he did tell Scott to turn it off quickly and thought the matter was done with. I’m sure Ethan in his current state won’t think that distinction as good enough. Because it gave cover for Scott to do this. I can see Ethan listening and needing time to forgive Lucas. And maybe an act of contrition to restore Zeke will make it right. But I don’t… Read more »
Has anybody else noticed that ZK is now being referred to as Zeke?
He was already being referenced as Zeke right after he chose ZK. Ethan was coming up with monikers, said “Zeke,” to which Zeke replied “I’ll allow it.”
“You should be running right now.”
Or rolling. Whatever.
I wonder how much this robot is similar to the android from the world of Wild Cards.
I don’t get why Ethan is accepting Scott’s logic so readily. They are in a world of super powered people – every day there are probably new threats and problems. The idea that an AI that can’t propagate itself exists seems like it is just par for the course. Much like finding a new super powered person – Zeke is basically just a new super powered person with the power to be an electronic life form. I think Ethan should be replying to Scott that he’s just a paranoid ass who is so afraid of even potential change and his… Read more »
Game Haven is going to be full of awkward silences for a few weeks.
And a Supervillain is born!
This so-called machine was attaining sentience like nothing else before them. They should’ve at least have had a say in what happens to them. Scott shouldn’t be the sole arbiter of their fate, and to put himself in that position sparks of hubris. It’s also an incredible betrayal of trust.
Wow. Dominoes are falling kind of where I expected. So prediction time, I guess. 20% chance, all three think that Zeke is gone for good. If so, 70% chance Ethan ‘splits the party’ by firing Scott, and maybe 50/50 on Lucas firing/eviction. 30% chance for grudging acceptance. 80% chance that they think that Zeke is salvageable, either from the main memory not being as damaged as they thought, or Scott or Z having a sneaky memory dump. If so, 70% chance that Scott reconciles by attempting to fix his mistake, and 30% chance that he refuses, prompting Ethan to yank… Read more »
Firing Scott is inevitable, he betrayed their thrust, after saying he trusted Lucas. Scott will become an Anti-hero, and probably make his own robot army to fight the Master and other heroes he disagrees with. Probably splitting after Ethan Mentions he’s glad his sister never learned what kind of person Scott really is. and that Scott is unworthy to have ever dated his sister. Ethan and Lucas will talk about what happened, and that Lucas while at fault for allowing the bomb to still be active, did think it was deactivated after ZK took a name, and he talked to… Read more »
Also, yay for awesome sneaky lore insert!
Ethan looks at ZK and sees Johnny 5.
Scott looks at ZK and sees Ultron.
The real problem is that they’re both right and neither one is willing to really see things from the other’s perspective.
If anime has taught me anything, it’s that Ethan is going to learn new, insanely powerful aspects to his power now, and they’ll be powerless against the next the next boss guy.
So strange so see Ethan’s sideburns. Also very impressive attention to detail for Ethan, but I guess this is the bit more focused version than the original comic one.
Maybe this is where Ethan fixes Zeke and ties together with the old continuity where he built Zeke in the first place with no idea how he accomplished it.
Maybe not the best plot device, but eh.
A good talk, wow. Also I like the Elden Ring banner. I like how you just run with the real world video game releases here.
The Elden Ring poster framed behind Lucas is a pretty nice touch. Tarnished indeed.
Called it. Ethan is using the arguments I presented in the previous strip’s comments.
And Scott continues to make the same mistake I mentioned, of course. Short-sightedness.
Contain it? You just can’t. And it ALWAYS backfires, when you try to “contain” the different. Especially since what you call “containment,” the different rightfully call imprisonment/torture/abuse/genocide/etc.
Zeke’s not an idiot, he’s just friends with one. I’m sure he made/backed up a copy of himself on a toaster or something.
Scott is trying to razionalize and has some reason, but it’s basically racist. He want to destroy zeke anyway because they’re a new species. He is wrong. He is like some umanity in the x-men comics, he fear zeke not because it’s a murder machine, but because it exist. And it’s a point of view that can easy became villany, it isn’t really different from the master.
“Chapter 8: The Breaking of the Fellowship” ?
In terms of super-beings you should worry about pissing off, the serially-respawning virtual immortal might be fairly high on your list. Killing his friend? Bad idea. Refusing to refer to his friend as a person while trying to paint yourself as a world-saving hero for killing said friend: Really bad idea. I’m trying to remember whether he lied to the other super about disabling the bomb entirely, or just lied about expanding the geofencing on the bomb to encompass the whole store (never mind that Zeke could have embezzled billions of dollars without moving an inch, amongst other cyber-crimes he… Read more »
From BatEthan to PunishEthan ?
Probably gonna get blasted for this, but..
Scott was the only one thinking rationally. Just because Zeke was behaving, didn’t make him any less of a threat to the human race. And more so, Zeke is a super-intelligent android. Who’s to say he wasn’t playing them all? Stating that it amused him once he inevitably betrayed them?
A gun with a conscience is still a gun, after all. And again, if anyone got their hands on Zeke’s schematics, and found a way to copy his programming without his few morals, that’s literally game over for the entire human race.
I really like the game haven scenes always those fun details in some place, like this time the Elden ring poster behind Lucas.
Bummer with Zecke though
Somethings been bugging me is this storyline a prequel, reboot or something else?
Reboot. Same characters, but a completely different world in which they live. In the first comic, Ethan and Lilah meet because they’re both gamers. In this reboot, they meet because of crime in the city, as a super and reporter. The first comic didn’t really have any supernatural stuff except for Zeke.
I get that Scott has his reasons to be wary of robots and all…but it just sucks he did never even stop to *consider* they could actually be sentient. Or maybe cuz it was more convenient not to entertain that thought? Anyway, while I *do* understand the argument of Zeke *potentially* posing a big risk I feel that argument just doesn’t hold water if you think about it. Even with a former killer robot around that may or may not undergo rehabilitation, the biggest risk to humans still would be and for the foreseeable future stay their fellow humans. And… Read more »