Zer0 from Borderlands 2 is not human… though he might also not be a similar style of robot to this guy here and X1 might not have read the lore and thus assumed he was just a weird human.
He’s certainly not presented as anything but human on the character select screen. And X1 doesn’t strike me as the “read all the lore of the game before playing it” sort of bot.
I’m not completely sure how visible it is on the character selection screen, but he actually only has 3 fingers and a thumb on each hand, not 4. And the lore that suggests he might not be human but maybe a robot, or something else, is actually from an audio log that you come across in-game, not any lore that’s available before starting it (unless you notice the fingers).
Shinji Schneider
3 years ago
Considering “They” is a perfectly good and established pronoun for people with unknown gender, undefined gender or any gender outside of the binary spectrum, i’m pretty sure this is where we will end up.
Unless of course the robot (i’m not calling them Zeke yet) decided that their name will be their gender because let’s face it. They are unique anyway.
-Schlock Mercenary, Book 10: The Longshoreman of the Apocalypse.
Lota is definitely an interesting example in which an AI chooses neither he, nor she, nor it, but instead insists upon their name being the only thing by which they are addressed. Lota however does make exceptions in which the pronouns in question refer to Lota as part of a more glorious whole, such as a group of friends.
I would argue that while Lota is obviously devoid of pronouns, after the events of Book 10 this is less showboating and more dependent on Lota’s grandiose role as the ruler – no, the pillar – of Credomar. Lota sees “Lota” as being representative of all the people of Credomar, and so does not merit pronouns in the same sense as the Royal “we”.
There are no such human beings with unknown gender…….. there are only 2 for humans. I gotta say it is frustrating to see someone take another form of entertainment and ruin it with left wing political propaganda but I guess in this case it is at least a product that is owned by one person and he can do as he wishes. Just really frustrating and before anyone ignorantly says that is not what this is ….. no reason to waste time arguing over something else that is fact. No one in this current culture is accidentally stumbling into the… Read more »
Your problem is assuming this is a political issue rather than a biological and psychological one. Whether or not you agree with peoples views of gender, by assuming someone is taking a political stance in the matter you are showing your ignorance on the matter as a whole. You can disagree with the issue and even have valid points about your disagreement but by claiming its “left-wing” shows that you do not consider the issue a “human” issue, which it is first and foremost.
The actual facts are of a scientific nature – no one in the actual scientific world is really arguing there is more than xx or xy. The discussion is of a political nature hence my analysis is true. For the record someone who is NOT a liberal can still spew liberal propaganda. There currently is no documented conservative propaganda on this subject.
I find that most people when they are being pointed out as being wrong – like to just point and say ignorant – you don’t understand my feels therefore you are wrong – I’ll add your comment to the data pool.
As someone in the “actual scientific world”, I can assure you that there are more sex chromosome combinations than xx and xy. You can have xxx, xxy, xyy. You can have just x (Turner Syndrome). More rarely you can even have xxxx or xxyy.
I came here to write almost exactly that. I learned all this in high school science classes in a deep red state. The science is only up for discussion in the political realm, and it is infuriating that elected officials don’t have the knowledge or the will to research to get a better understanding of what is really going on.
There is so much stuff out there in the “actual scientific world”, seriously its one google search away. But you either choose to ignore it, or don’t even look because god forbid something might challenge your personal narrative. The fact that you say that there is “no documented conservative propaganda” tells me you are literally a lost cause. That your chosen “side” can do know wrong. It reminds me of people who describe Nazism as actually a left wing ideology, because they called it “National Socialism” (Ignoring facts like how Communist Russia and North Korea literally call themselves Republics in… Read more »
There are lots of trans people on the Right – some are even out of the closet. There would be a lot more if Right-wing political propaganda didn’t keep calling them abominations.
Please list for the gallery the facts you are claiming. Just so we are all well acquainted with your words.
Your claim there is only XX and XY has zero scientific merit. It has been in text books in deep red states for several decades, so its not new science created out of a desire to prop up ideologies.
The existence of living beings with xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy pretty much negates your entire binary argument.
So, please explain further the facts you base your argument on.
There aren’t even just two distinct sexes for humans — people are born with intersex characteristics all the time. Aside from that, assigned sexual characteristics can be distinct from gender — and just like Zeke (or whatever his new name ends up being) here, you get to choose what gender you wish the world to reference you as.
I didn’t ask about characteristics. XX vs XY – I think they call that a mic drop moment and the sweet thing is you have 11 people who jumped on your band wagon with you 🙂
“I can assure you that there are more sex chromosome combinations than xx and xy. You can have xxx, xxy, xyy. You can have just x (Turner Syndrome). More rarely you can even have xxxx or xxyy.”
Dude, this is probably the most non-political, non-controversial expression of gender that you could actually come across, because it’s not about humans. You have an actual thing there that actually has no biological gender trying to figure out how it wants to identify itself, when the language itself infers that thinking beings are gendered.
If you can’t read this and at least put your own biases aside, it’s not the comic that’s at fault. You’ve got a chip on your shoulder you’ve got to overcome.
My reply was to someone who make a comment about humans. Then I added my frustration with the human who made it and how he make his political point with the “humans” in the comic. I don’t have biases – I have facts in this conversation – I’m not a liberal.
Please list for the gallery the facts you are claiming. Just so we are all well acquainted with your words.
Your claim there is only XX and XY has zero scientific merit. It has been in text books in deep red states for several decades, so its not new science created out of a desire to prop up ideologies.
The existence of living beings with xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy pretty much negates your entire binary argument.
So, please explain further the facts you base your argument on.
Your reply was completely off-base to Shinji’s point. Even by your own logic, you’re wrong. You stated that there are no people of unknown gender, which is not true. It happens all the time in language. If I say, “I have set this whoopee cushion down; when someone sits on it, it will sound like they farted,” it is correct to say ‘they’. It is incorrect to say ‘he’ ‘she’ or ‘it.’ This is not political leftist hogwash, it is actual English, and has been a part of the language since before Shakespeare’s time. So you have no argument for… Read more »
You are using language – an art – to try to discuss factual science? Wanna try again? The shortfalls of your language doesn’t actually apply to the discussion.
First – I am not discussing science. At all. In any capacity. Science was not the discussion, unless you want to call it ‘psychology,’ in which language IS the tool we use, as it’s what the brain assigns meaning to. The only way that science has entered the conversation is, you’ve steered the question away from one about self-awareness, identity, and psychology, into biology. Which is stupid, as again, this is a non-biological being. Your arguments have zero merit. Would a human have the same exact conversation? No, because they have a jumping-off point. X1 doesn’t, and because of that,… Read more »
As compared to”ruining entertainment”with right wing propaganda?
Sigh
If you’re going to complain about someone expressing their (presumably) position, then you really look silly when you express yours simultaneously don’t you.
Congratulations on also being wrong about science. Even in a restrictive world view sex (biology) and gender (cultural expectations) are not the same thing. There are a number of cultures world wide that have more than two genders. Even in the Western world Italy had a tradition of more than 2 through the 19th century.
Please list for the gallery the facts you are claiming. Just so we are all well acquainted with your words.
Your claim there is only XX and XY has zero scientific merit. It has been in text books in deep red states for several decades, so its not new science created out of a desire to prop up ideologies.
The existence of living beings with xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy pretty much negates your entire binary argument.
So, please explain further the facts you base your argument on.
That feeling you have, that people are “ruining” things with “left wing political propaganda” because they’re comfortable bringing up psychological traits like gender and identity? That’s just the world moving on without you. In spite of you, even. You’re still railing about how its all fake while the rest of the world has not only acknowledged its existence, but accommodated it to improve both their own and others quality of life. You are every bit as backwards and insane as racist grandparents who die believing in their bones that ancestry dictates your value as a person. You will be forgotten,… Read more »
To associate racism (someone’s characteristics they can’t control) with a discussion about someone WANTING to chose their gender instead of listening to the scientific facts on the subject – is a retarded stance to take. I don’t even know a nicer way to put it.
I to instantly know the gender of every person I interact with on the internet, speak to over text program, or in any other case where the exact identity is unknown, thus have no use for the word they.
In French there is no gender neutral pronoun for singular or plural, we just add an ‘s’ to the singular Il ou Elle to say there’s more than one. But some people are starting to use iel which is a mashup for non-gendered people
German actually has the same issue with no genderneutral pronoun being present.
Considering that german pronouns are a huge clusterfuck anyway (seriously. The pronoun for “bus” is “he”, the pronoun for “cat” is “she” and the pronoun for “girl” is “it”) i think it will take a long time to find a solution there.
German is kinda funky in that “es/it” pronouns overlap with “er/he”‘s while formal “Sie/You/They” pronouns overlap with “sie/she”… and each other’s lol. The situation is kind of a mess, but at least the gendering in German feels pretty arbitrary? And at least being formal kind of opts out of gender completely. I think this kind of situation is part of why “they” has adopted a singular form in English (the first recorded case being all the way back around 1375 CE, which was Middle English), much like how “thou” as the singular form of “you” is now outdated.
Gender identity and names are very human concepts, so it wouldn’t surprise me if they don’t apply here. On the other hand, while “They” is a perfectly acceptable and established pronoun, it’s possible they do want to identify as either male or female, though it’s equally as likely that they will not. Perhaps, in the end, gender and name won’t apply because “those are human concepts and humans are gross” so they (for lack of a better way to refer to someone with no pronouns, at least that I know of) will simply choose not to have any and will… Read more »
Right moist floppy horrorshow that needs to go into the dictionary
Gamebecile
3 years ago
I don’t understand the objection to “it” sure, some people use “it” in a derogatory manner, but there is no reason to care about the opinions of insignificant fleshbags.
The color of his eyes suggests that he DOES care what the insignificant fleshbags think. He wouldn’t have ever had this conversation before Winter-Een-Mas.
HappyWyvern
3 years ago
I continue to love how expressive the robot manages to be with just the eyes to work with. Panel 2 being a wonderful example of it.
Alan
3 years ago
There is no delete button for your own comments – even ones yet to be approved. How ’bout that.
Last edited 3 years ago by Alan
Humsterr
3 years ago
I think Ethan was just envious of a creature who is free to go pantless whenever. Why would you choose to wear pants in this case is unfathomable to him
Dodgy
3 years ago
Holup! Your gender is defined when you are born. It is how you are and will be identified as a gender for the rest of your life unless you opt for surgery and even then that doesn’t change anything about your biological makeup except for the outer appearance. One does not CHOOSE his or her gender, it’s predefined on a genetic level. That also means it does not apply to the robot. It’s biological and thus irrelevant unless some parts of the robot contain living tissue that at one time belonged to a pre-existing creature. And then there is the… Read more »
You’re describing biological sex, not gender. Gender is the social and emotional aspect which is usually, but not definitively, linked to biological sex. It’s a social construct that has changed over time to encompass whatever we currently define as “masculine” or “feminine” which are not static concepts.
You are confusion gender with sex. (Though depending on your primary language, those two concepts might use the same word) Sex (the organs you have) is genetic, though it can be adjusted with surgery. Gender however is a social construct, partially based around sex, and indeed how you choose to identify. Considering many parents assign you a gender based entirely on your genitals immediately after birth, you may have to change that later on in life to reflect what your brain actually needs it to be. Sex = female / male / intersex / … Gender = man / woman… Read more »
How do you suppose someone with any of these chromosomal anomalies (xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy) might present biologically, and to what degree?
It is always “simple” to have an answer when you haven’t taken the time to familiarize yourself with the facts of the discussion.
Seeing Zeke getting an identity crisis has no right to be this good
Eldest Gruff
3 years ago
What I think is hilarious is that Tim’s presented this in as tame a manner as possible – X1 *is* a sexless being, the language demands he MUST choose a gender, they start with the basis of choosing it by physical parts and rule it out, Lucas says he doesn’t “have to” choose by body (as opposed to “that has nothing to do with gender”), and yet- -and yet the comments section explodes with people absolutely triggered by the thought of, “How DARE a sentient AI even contemplate if it should be called ‘he’ or ‘she’ and how DARE someone… Read more »
What I appreciate is the far greater number of people that are in support of this line of examination and that are ready to educate those triggered by the subject.
While I appreciate your points, could you stop using triggered in such a manner? Unless these people are having ptsd episodes over it they aren’t triggered, they’re just butthurt. A trigger is a real psychological term, not just something you get angry over.
I doubt any sentient “AI” would care if they were called “he” or “she”. Language is use, and I don’t see that robot having any use for it.
Blobby
3 years ago
Ethan’s right, though. He’s been out of the Master’s hands for some time now. The pants may be purely decorative, but they’re emblematic of the tastes of Zeke’s most hated enemy. He’s been wearing them by choice, and even if Zeke likes pants, it seems he’d have asked for some different ones by now.
Tim I just wanted to say that I am loving this whole story line. It just shows the confusion and how much we all need to listen and learn on this subject. You’re doing great!
Him.
3 years ago
We just need a good name…
Not “X”, that’s just what you were once called.
X…Y…Z…
Ze…Ze…Zeckariah!
Wow. They are really playing a Kirk on “him”. If anyone knew how to totally mindf**k an AI is was the Captain.
Richard Weatherfield
3 years ago
Well, he’s not wrong. since robots have no gender upon construction, he can do whaetver the heck he wants.
Stein
3 years ago
Thousands or years of Science development and technology. This is where we are today… We have super computers in our pocket and access to the worlds knowledge but people are confused about their “gender”. Sounds more like people are just way to bored in life and trying to find anything and everything to complain about.
Imagine having access to the global repository of knowledge in your pocket and not taking one iota of effort to do a bit of reading about how sex, sexuality, and gender identity, and societal perceptions thereof, have evolved over decades of biological and psychological research.
It’s much easier to pretend the world is simple when cut off from most of it. Obliviousness to complexity doesn’t stop it from having been there all along. It just coddles the minds of simpletons.
Really, it’s that access to the world’s knowledge that is so disruptive. More and more people are having to acknowledge that just maybe they didn’t figure out the whole universe when they discovered the magic of flint and steel.
I can think of a great many people in this United States who might take umbrage with that line of thinking considering each wave of new immigrant to the country was tagged with hostile demeaning language to identify them that is still in use by less desirable attitudes today. I am sure if you went and told all those treated with hostile words simply for the color of their skin, their perceived national origin, or their outwardly religious attire they might have some words for you about being treated equally for who they are and not for what others don’t… Read more »
Why would any of this (name, gender, identity) matter at all to an AI? For a robot who’s terminal goal is to “kill all humans”, he’s so human it’s stupid.
It is a consciousness exploring the bounds of it’s existence beyond what it would normally consider. It’s simple to assume it would have done so by now but that isn’t an absolute and a biological creature likely wouldn’t have this particular issue. They may decide that it IS altogether unimportant in the end.
Merendel
3 years ago
Lol, all this deep serious talk and all ethan can do is try to extract the mental image of his robot friends junk out of his head and fail miserably.
Never change your adorkable goofball.
SpammerD
3 years ago
I hope they keep the name Zeke.
Rake
3 years ago
Tim, I just want to express how much I’m impressed with your writing for this subplot. It’s come such a long way from your earliest stories.
Rakshiir
3 years ago
Now here is an interesting question. In regards to gender: No, I dont think there is a reason why a robot would need that, since they dont reproduce like humans, or animals. The question for me is: does the want to have a gender exist or not. For “us humans”: the he/she identification works for the big majority, so it is still a pretty valid system to this day in my opinion. People who dont feel like the biological gender fits them need something thats true. But a system that is valid for more than 90% of the race? Thats… Read more »
24
…….Damit! now I’m thinking of it it too!
Huh. I thought our X1 was over the name debacle as early as Fire Emblem or Borderlands series when making a user name. Not a moot point I guess.
he’s probably using a randomly generated String
Those are all human characters. Names aren’t so important when you’re typing in “Meatbag.”
Zer0 from Borderlands 2 is not human… though he might also not be a similar style of robot to this guy here and X1 might not have read the lore and thus assumed he was just a weird human.
He’s certainly not presented as anything but human on the character select screen. And X1 doesn’t strike me as the “read all the lore of the game before playing it” sort of bot.
Maybe he’s the “play the whole game in your head first” kind of bot.
I’m not completely sure how visible it is on the character selection screen, but he actually only has 3 fingers and a thumb on each hand, not 4. And the lore that suggests he might not be human but maybe a robot, or something else, is actually from an audio log that you come across in-game, not any lore that’s available before starting it (unless you notice the fingers).
Considering “They” is a perfectly good and established pronoun for people with unknown gender, undefined gender or any gender outside of the binary spectrum, i’m pretty sure this is where we will end up.
Unless of course the robot (i’m not calling them Zeke yet) decided that their name will be their gender because let’s face it. They are unique anyway.
Lota is above puny pronouns.
-Schlock Mercenary, Book 10: The Longshoreman of the Apocalypse.
Lota is definitely an interesting example in which an AI chooses neither he, nor she, nor it, but instead insists upon their name being the only thing by which they are addressed. Lota however does make exceptions in which the pronouns in question refer to Lota as part of a more glorious whole, such as a group of friends.
I would argue that while Lota is obviously devoid of pronouns, after the events of Book 10 this is less showboating and more dependent on Lota’s grandiose role as the ruler – no, the pillar – of Credomar. Lota sees “Lota” as being representative of all the people of Credomar, and so does not merit pronouns in the same sense as the Royal “we”.
There are no such human beings with unknown gender…….. there are only 2 for humans. I gotta say it is frustrating to see someone take another form of entertainment and ruin it with left wing political propaganda but I guess in this case it is at least a product that is owned by one person and he can do as he wishes. Just really frustrating and before anyone ignorantly says that is not what this is ….. no reason to waste time arguing over something else that is fact. No one in this current culture is accidentally stumbling into the… Read more »
Your problem is assuming this is a political issue rather than a biological and psychological one. Whether or not you agree with peoples views of gender, by assuming someone is taking a political stance in the matter you are showing your ignorance on the matter as a whole. You can disagree with the issue and even have valid points about your disagreement but by claiming its “left-wing” shows that you do not consider the issue a “human” issue, which it is first and foremost.
Anon A Mouse, that’s a beautiful post.
The actual facts are of a scientific nature – no one in the actual scientific world is really arguing there is more than xx or xy. The discussion is of a political nature hence my analysis is true. For the record someone who is NOT a liberal can still spew liberal propaganda. There currently is no documented conservative propaganda on this subject.
Everything, like every single thing, in your comment is incorrect on so many levels that it can only be active willful ignorance or trolling.
I find that most people when they are being pointed out as being wrong – like to just point and say ignorant – you don’t understand my feels therefore you are wrong – I’ll add your comment to the data pool.
As someone in the “actual scientific world”, I can assure you that there are more sex chromosome combinations than xx and xy. You can have xxx, xxy, xyy. You can have just x (Turner Syndrome). More rarely you can even have xxxx or xxyy.
I came here to write almost exactly that. I learned all this in high school science classes in a deep red state. The science is only up for discussion in the political realm, and it is infuriating that elected officials don’t have the knowledge or the will to research to get a better understanding of what is really going on.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! I can’t decide which comment is stupider Louis; this one or the one about the “actual scientific world”.
There is so much stuff out there in the “actual scientific world”, seriously its one google search away. But you either choose to ignore it, or don’t even look because god forbid something might challenge your personal narrative. The fact that you say that there is “no documented conservative propaganda” tells me you are literally a lost cause. That your chosen “side” can do know wrong. It reminds me of people who describe Nazism as actually a left wing ideology, because they called it “National Socialism” (Ignoring facts like how Communist Russia and North Korea literally call themselves Republics in… Read more »
Uhhhh, what about X or XXY? Those are real things, ya derp. Even within its own context your logic doesn’t hold up.
the fact you cant just enjoy a robot learning the meaning of a self identity shows alot about yourself, and none of it is a good thing.
There are lots of trans people on the Right – some are even out of the closet. There would be a lot more if Right-wing political propaganda didn’t keep calling them abominations.
Stating a fact is in fact NOT propaganda…… I’ll let you get acquainted with the words we are using and then we can pick up back where you fell off 🙂
Please list for the gallery the facts you are claiming. Just so we are all well acquainted with your words.
Your claim there is only XX and XY has zero scientific merit. It has been in text books in deep red states for several decades, so its not new science created out of a desire to prop up ideologies.
The existence of living beings with xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy pretty much negates your entire binary argument.
So, please explain further the facts you base your argument on.
There aren’t even just two distinct sexes for humans — people are born with intersex characteristics all the time. Aside from that, assigned sexual characteristics can be distinct from gender — and just like Zeke (or whatever his new name ends up being) here, you get to choose what gender you wish the world to reference you as.
I didn’t ask about characteristics. XX vs XY – I think they call that a mic drop moment and the sweet thing is you have 11 people who jumped on your band wagon with you 🙂
Via PlayingItSafe
“I can assure you that there are more sex chromosome combinations than xx and xy. You can have xxx, xxy, xyy. You can have just x (Turner Syndrome). More rarely you can even have xxxx or xxyy.”
Dude, this is probably the most non-political, non-controversial expression of gender that you could actually come across, because it’s not about humans. You have an actual thing there that actually has no biological gender trying to figure out how it wants to identify itself, when the language itself infers that thinking beings are gendered.
If you can’t read this and at least put your own biases aside, it’s not the comic that’s at fault. You’ve got a chip on your shoulder you’ve got to overcome.
My reply was to someone who make a comment about humans. Then I added my frustration with the human who made it and how he make his political point with the “humans” in the comic. I don’t have biases – I have facts in this conversation – I’m not a liberal.
Please list for the gallery the facts you are claiming. Just so we are all well acquainted with your words.
Your claim there is only XX and XY has zero scientific merit. It has been in text books in deep red states for several decades, so its not new science created out of a desire to prop up ideologies.
The existence of living beings with xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy pretty much negates your entire binary argument.
So, please explain further the facts you base your argument on.
Your reply was completely off-base to Shinji’s point. Even by your own logic, you’re wrong. You stated that there are no people of unknown gender, which is not true. It happens all the time in language. If I say, “I have set this whoopee cushion down; when someone sits on it, it will sound like they farted,” it is correct to say ‘they’. It is incorrect to say ‘he’ ‘she’ or ‘it.’ This is not political leftist hogwash, it is actual English, and has been a part of the language since before Shakespeare’s time. So you have no argument for… Read more »
You are using language – an art – to try to discuss factual science? Wanna try again? The shortfalls of your language doesn’t actually apply to the discussion.
First – I am not discussing science. At all. In any capacity. Science was not the discussion, unless you want to call it ‘psychology,’ in which language IS the tool we use, as it’s what the brain assigns meaning to. The only way that science has entered the conversation is, you’ve steered the question away from one about self-awareness, identity, and psychology, into biology. Which is stupid, as again, this is a non-biological being. Your arguments have zero merit. Would a human have the same exact conversation? No, because they have a jumping-off point. X1 doesn’t, and because of that,… Read more »
As compared to”ruining entertainment”with right wing propaganda?
Sigh
If you’re going to complain about someone expressing their (presumably) position, then you really look silly when you express yours simultaneously don’t you.
You quote science, morons disregard science
Congratulations on also being wrong about science. Even in a restrictive world view sex (biology) and gender (cultural expectations) are not the same thing. There are a number of cultures world wide that have more than two genders. Even in the Western world Italy had a tradition of more than 2 through the 19th century.
https://www.pbs.org/independentlens/content/two-spirits_map-html/
Yup a whole lotta people replying about their feelings and somehow think it’s relevant to facts 🙂
Please list for the gallery the facts you are claiming. Just so we are all well acquainted with your words.
Your claim there is only XX and XY has zero scientific merit. It has been in text books in deep red states for several decades, so its not new science created out of a desire to prop up ideologies.
The existence of living beings with xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy pretty much negates your entire binary argument.
So, please explain further the facts you base your argument on.
That feeling you have, that people are “ruining” things with “left wing political propaganda” because they’re comfortable bringing up psychological traits like gender and identity? That’s just the world moving on without you. In spite of you, even. You’re still railing about how its all fake while the rest of the world has not only acknowledged its existence, but accommodated it to improve both their own and others quality of life. You are every bit as backwards and insane as racist grandparents who die believing in their bones that ancestry dictates your value as a person. You will be forgotten,… Read more »
To associate racism (someone’s characteristics they can’t control) with a discussion about someone WANTING to chose their gender instead of listening to the scientific facts on the subject – is a retarded stance to take. I don’t even know a nicer way to put it.
Have fun reading another comic. May I recommend some Chick Tracts?
I miss that cute little demon dog – such a good hellspawn
I to instantly know the gender of every person I interact with on the internet, speak to over text program, or in any other case where the exact identity is unknown, thus have no use for the word they.
A lot of ignorance about biology helps being certain that gender is completely binary.
In French there is no gender neutral pronoun for singular or plural, we just add an ‘s’ to the singular Il ou Elle to say there’s more than one. But some people are starting to use iel which is a mashup for non-gendered people
German actually has the same issue with no genderneutral pronoun being present.
Considering that german pronouns are a huge clusterfuck anyway (seriously. The pronoun for “bus” is “he”, the pronoun for “cat” is “she” and the pronoun for “girl” is “it”) i think it will take a long time to find a solution there.
We have “er”, “sie”, “es”, but “es” feels rather like “not a living thing”.
German is kinda funky in that “es/it” pronouns overlap with “er/he”‘s while formal “Sie/You/They” pronouns overlap with “sie/she”… and each other’s lol. The situation is kind of a mess, but at least the gendering in German feels pretty arbitrary? And at least being formal kind of opts out of gender completely. I think this kind of situation is part of why “they” has adopted a singular form in English (the first recorded case being all the way back around 1375 CE, which was Middle English), much like how “thou” as the singular form of “you” is now outdated.
I was wondering about that. Thank you for that clarification.
Gender identity and names are very human concepts, so it wouldn’t surprise me if they don’t apply here. On the other hand, while “They” is a perfectly acceptable and established pronoun, it’s possible they do want to identify as either male or female, though it’s equally as likely that they will not. Perhaps, in the end, gender and name won’t apply because “those are human concepts and humans are gross” so they (for lack of a better way to refer to someone with no pronouns, at least that I know of) will simply choose not to have any and will… Read more »
So basically their name and pronoun will be…
“RUN!!!!!!”
Seriously, one of the best and hilarious ctrl+alt+del comics till now. rofl
Right moist floppy horrorshow that needs to go into the dictionary
I don’t understand the objection to “it” sure, some people use “it” in a derogatory manner, but there is no reason to care about the opinions of insignificant fleshbags.
The color of his eyes suggests that he DOES care what the insignificant fleshbags think. He wouldn’t have ever had this conversation before Winter-Een-Mas.
I continue to love how expressive the robot manages to be with just the eyes to work with. Panel 2 being a wonderful example of it.
There is no delete button for your own comments – even ones yet to be approved. How ’bout that.
I think Ethan was just envious of a creature who is free to go pantless whenever. Why would you choose to wear pants in this case is unfathomable to him
Holup! Your gender is defined when you are born. It is how you are and will be identified as a gender for the rest of your life unless you opt for surgery and even then that doesn’t change anything about your biological makeup except for the outer appearance. One does not CHOOSE his or her gender, it’s predefined on a genetic level. That also means it does not apply to the robot. It’s biological and thus irrelevant unless some parts of the robot contain living tissue that at one time belonged to a pre-existing creature. And then there is the… Read more »
You’re describing biological sex, not gender. Gender is the social and emotional aspect which is usually, but not definitively, linked to biological sex. It’s a social construct that has changed over time to encompass whatever we currently define as “masculine” or “feminine” which are not static concepts.
You are confusion gender with sex. (Though depending on your primary language, those two concepts might use the same word) Sex (the organs you have) is genetic, though it can be adjusted with surgery. Gender however is a social construct, partially based around sex, and indeed how you choose to identify. Considering many parents assign you a gender based entirely on your genitals immediately after birth, you may have to change that later on in life to reflect what your brain actually needs it to be. Sex = female / male / intersex / … Gender = man / woman… Read more »
Accurate username, because that is dodgy af.
You’re confusing “sex” with “gender.” They aren’t the same thing. And even sex isn’t…quite that simple.
have a friend who was born with both sets of sexual organs, what would you call them? go on, im waiting on your 2 choice answer to define that one.
Quite simple, which is his dominant genetic makeup? Because that’s the one.
When you’re being simple-minded, I suppose a lot of complicated things are ‘simple’.
Dominant genetic makeup?
That’s not how it works my friends.
How do you suppose someone with any of these chromosomal anomalies (xxx, xxy, xyy, just x, xxxx, and xxyy) might present biologically, and to what degree?
It is always “simple” to have an answer when you haven’t taken the time to familiarize yourself with the facts of the discussion.
Quite a few summer children here…
As I said to the other clown up above, go read a Chick Tract.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Güevedoce
Congrats, Tim!
Seeing Zeke getting an identity crisis has no right to be this good
What I think is hilarious is that Tim’s presented this in as tame a manner as possible – X1 *is* a sexless being, the language demands he MUST choose a gender, they start with the basis of choosing it by physical parts and rule it out, Lucas says he doesn’t “have to” choose by body (as opposed to “that has nothing to do with gender”), and yet- -and yet the comments section explodes with people absolutely triggered by the thought of, “How DARE a sentient AI even contemplate if it should be called ‘he’ or ‘she’ and how DARE someone… Read more »
What I appreciate is the far greater number of people that are in support of this line of examination and that are ready to educate those triggered by the subject.
While I appreciate your points, could you stop using triggered in such a manner? Unless these people are having ptsd episodes over it they aren’t triggered, they’re just butthurt. A trigger is a real psychological term, not just something you get angry over.
They seem to be in psychological distress and unable to cope with the thought about having an option to embrace their cross-gender side.
I doubt any sentient “AI” would care if they were called “he” or “she”. Language is use, and I don’t see that robot having any use for it.
Ethan’s right, though. He’s been out of the Master’s hands for some time now. The pants may be purely decorative, but they’re emblematic of the tastes of Zeke’s most hated enemy. He’s been wearing them by choice, and even if Zeke likes pants, it seems he’d have asked for some different ones by now.
I don’t think that they are bad taste.
Tim I just wanted to say that I am loving this whole story line. It just shows the confusion and how much we all need to listen and learn on this subject. You’re doing great!
We just need a good name…
Not “X”, that’s just what you were once called.
X…Y…Z…
Ze…Ze…Zeckariah!
(For anyone new here, Ethan does seem to want to call X1 Gizmo, I’m just making a joke)
I do believe that if Ethan tried to call X1 Gizmo there may be an accidental respawn
I thought it was Ezekiel? ?
Wow. They are really playing a Kirk on “him”. If anyone knew how to totally mindf**k an AI is was the Captain.
Well, he’s not wrong. since robots have no gender upon construction, he can do whaetver the heck he wants.
Thousands or years of Science development and technology. This is where we are today… We have super computers in our pocket and access to the worlds knowledge but people are confused about their “gender”. Sounds more like people are just way to bored in life and trying to find anything and everything to complain about.
Imagine having access to the global repository of knowledge in your pocket and not taking one iota of effort to do a bit of reading about how sex, sexuality, and gender identity, and societal perceptions thereof, have evolved over decades of biological and psychological research.
It’s much easier to pretend the world is simple when cut off from most of it. Obliviousness to complexity doesn’t stop it from having been there all along. It just coddles the minds of simpletons.
Really, it’s that access to the world’s knowledge that is so disruptive. More and more people are having to acknowledge that just maybe they didn’t figure out the whole universe when they discovered the magic of flint and steel.
Yup, so much things to think about and all people do is getting butthurt about how other people call them.
I can think of a great many people in this United States who might take umbrage with that line of thinking considering each wave of new immigrant to the country was tagged with hostile demeaning language to identify them that is still in use by less desirable attitudes today. I am sure if you went and told all those treated with hostile words simply for the color of their skin, their perceived national origin, or their outwardly religious attire they might have some words for you about being treated equally for who they are and not for what others don’t… Read more »
Well said. I tried to say something along those lines but I kept wanting to use nasty language myself. Thank you for saying it better. .
Lucas inadvertently saves the world by showing a robot it can have a soul.
He would need to prove the existence of a soul first.
So do we get to see his reaction to Ethan calling him Gizmo in the next page?
Much ‘Duck!’ in Ethan’s future if he does do so.
Good Afternoon! I’m Murder, Murder Robot.
Why would any of this (name, gender, identity) matter at all to an AI? For a robot who’s terminal goal is to “kill all humans”, he’s so human it’s stupid.
It is a consciousness exploring the bounds of it’s existence beyond what it would normally consider. It’s simple to assume it would have done so by now but that isn’t an absolute and a biological creature likely wouldn’t have this particular issue. They may decide that it IS altogether unimportant in the end.
Lol, all this deep serious talk and all ethan can do is try to extract the mental image of his robot friends junk out of his head and fail miserably.
Never change your adorkable goofball.
I hope they keep the name Zeke.
Tim, I just want to express how much I’m impressed with your writing for this subplot. It’s come such a long way from your earliest stories.
Now here is an interesting question. In regards to gender: No, I dont think there is a reason why a robot would need that, since they dont reproduce like humans, or animals. The question for me is: does the want to have a gender exist or not. For “us humans”: the he/she identification works for the big majority, so it is still a pretty valid system to this day in my opinion. People who dont feel like the biological gender fits them need something thats true. But a system that is valid for more than 90% of the race? Thats… Read more »
Poor Ethan …