24

Saber Lite

November 11, 2019 by Tim

I sometimes find myself divided between the Dad in me, and the nerd in me. The Dad part of me always wins out, because my kids are the most important thing in my life. But I’ve been a nerd for much longer than I’ve been a Dad, so it’s still a pretty loud inner voice.

Even as a kid in the 90s, I remember complaining about the X-Men cartoon and how Wolverine only ever used his claws against the Sentinels, or to open doors. Against humans he would broadside them with the flat of the blade to knock them out, and it always bothered me, because I knew how he used his claws in the comics.

I’m looking forward to checking out Jedi: Fallen Order this week. I was not super blown away when it was first revealed, but through additional footage its slowly grown on me, with its Souls-inspired methodical combat and Uncharted-esque platforming. The Dad part of me is glad that it’s a game that my boys could watch me play, without seeing anything too graphic for them. That they could enjoy some cool Star Wars stuff.

But the nerd in me screams every time I see Cal slice through a Stormtrooper and no limbs go flying.


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Gonfrask
Gonfrask
1 year ago

I thought the same, well I thought the same since The Force Unleashed, that a game where you play as a Jedi with a light saber should be a bit more “butchery”, with limbs, heads and even bodies flying while you kill them (a llitle like the War in the North)

David
David
1 year ago

The reasoning given was that Disney wanted to keep the cutting off of limbs and such special and impactful since that is what they are in the movies. You see plenty of droids getting stuff lopped off, but whenever a humanoid gets cut up it’s in some special moment or something memorable. The arm in the bar, Obi-Wan’s death, Luke’s hand. That kind of thing.

geraintwd
geraintwd
1 year ago
Reply to  David

…Dooku’s head.

David Gibson
1 year ago
Reply to  David

Which makes sense, as Luke takes his lightsaber to half of Jabba’s barge and there’s not a single amputation or flying limb. Even in the throne room fight at the end of Last Jedi, there’s only a single decapitation.

Also.. you don’t really want to lop off limbs. That’s not a killing blow. The dude’s still in the fight. You go for the torso.

David
David
1 year ago
Reply to  David Gibson

It is, after all, just a flesh wound.

Sike-O
Sike-O
1 year ago
Reply to  David Gibson

You should have gone for the head

Merendel
Merendel
1 year ago
Reply to  David Gibson

Every time someone in starwars lost a limb to a lightsaber that more or less ended the fight. Anikin looses arm in clones, he’s out and yoda steps in. duku at the start of revenge looses hands, hes out. Cantina arm, Lukes hand at bespin, vader in the throne room, All fights basically stoped there. Besides if you’ve dismembered the guy and he’s still fighting effectively you were not through enough. The defiant torso can threaten to bite my legs off all it wants but its little more than a tripping hazard, much like a corpse. Difference is its much… Read more »

David Gibson
1 year ago
Reply to  Merendel

Yes, but after losing an arm to Dooku, Anakin killed him. After losing a hand to Vader, Luke bested him. After being cut in half by Obi-Wan, Maul came back and was a danger for years. Not going for the killing blow and finishing the job was a mistake each time. You dismember a stormtrooper rather than killing him? Congrats, you have now created a Shadows of Mordor style nemesis that will hunt you down. Plus, y’know, it keeps the rating down and lets the game be played by younger fans. Which makes sense give the franchise is based on… Read more »

Urazz
Urazz
1 year ago
Reply to  David Gibson

To be fair, Obi-Wan did go for a killing blow against Darth Maul and if I recall we did see a quick mist of blood evaporating when Darth Maul was cut in half.

Usually cutting an opponent in half through the torso is enough to kill almost all people. Guess you can thank the force and cybernetics for Maul surviving that. Though truth be told, I think it was BS that Darth Maul survived getting cut in half through the torso.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 year ago
Reply to  Urazz

Forget about getting cut in half, what about *falling down a massive hole* part?

Who the fuck caught him? HOW?!

Merendel
Merendel
1 year ago
Reply to  Kaitensatsuma

Maul was caught by the most powerful force of all. Plot and shoddy writing. David. Not saying leaving the enemy alive is always the wisest of choices. my point stands however, even if they came back stronger all those fights ended when the amputation happend even if they resulted in rematches months later. Amputations are sufficient to finish the immediate fight should there be value in keeping the target alive. If not well its not like its harder to remove just a bit more. also the shadow of mordor nemesis system was bullshit. I had nemesis’s return after decapitations. “You… Read more »

Gwydion_Wolf
Gwydion_Wolf
1 year ago
Reply to  David Gibson

There’s one thing your forgetting about lopping off limbs.

The fact that a Light-saber is essentially extremely hot plasma.

Having something that hot slice through you, even if its only an arm or a leg, will likely send a massive shock through your body’s nervous system (much the way that blaster bolts kill even though its just a small area they ‘hit’.) Not to mention instantly cauterized blood arteries/veins probably cause a issue with circulation / Blood pressure.

matt
matt
1 year ago
Reply to  Gwydion_Wolf

If it is actually hot enough to “cut” through flesh as shown in the movies, that’s sufficient heat to likely really blast off the limb. The liquids would convert to steam and create a large amount of steam pressure. There’d be no clean cutting involved. Lasers in surgery work because they are high enough power to cauterize. They don’t slice things apart. Its all about the speed of heat transfer. A laser can cut metal just fine it is powerful enough. But heat takes some time to transfer, a laser that can cut does it (relatively) slowly. To Star Wars… Read more »

Bwauder
Bwauder
1 year ago

I agree the science of the games universe should be more in play, but understand that in the current culture things end up cleaned up “to maintain the childrens innocence a little longer”, although its probably a waste of time considering what else they can find online with a quick age question lie, let alone just seeing the news. Even a realistic level of gore and violence probably wouldn’t satisfy some raised on Hollywood stunts and schlock horrors mess, so the safe alternative for a lower rating makes sense, even if the purists would like to see a saber do… Read more »

FireballDragon
FireballDragon
1 year ago

Speaking of 90s censorship, it always seemed dumb how Morbius in the Spider-Man cartoon had suckers on his hands to absorb “plasma,” unlike in the comics, where he sucked blood like a normal vampire.

Alexander Michael Gordy
Alexander Michael Gordy
1 year ago
Reply to  FireballDragon

Fun fact, that show was pretty gimped by the standards forced upon it. Spider-Man only actually throws like 5 punches in that whole series.

Urazz
Urazz
1 year ago
Reply to  FireballDragon

Yeah, wen I saw an episode of the 90’s Spiderman as an adult when I was babysitting my sister’s kids, I thought, wow, this seems exteremely perverted in some weird way. XD

Taylan Ertan
Taylan Ertan
1 year ago
Reply to  FireballDragon

Honestly? Those suckers were a lot more creepy for me than actual biting.

The rAt
The rAt
1 year ago
Reply to  FireballDragon

They also had a mandate (along with many other cartoons of the era) not to depict realistic guns. Hence why in a show set in the 90s, all the villains inexplicably had access to laser guns.

You can really see the censorship at play with how they handled the famous Green Goblin bridge confrontation – although admittedly not killing off Mary Jane in a kids cartoon was probably smart and did lead in some very interesting directions.

I loved that show as a kid, but man, itโ€™s hard to watch as an adult.

Dagroth
Dagroth
1 year ago

Yeah, the issue of lightsabers in Star Wars games always bothered me, too, although for a different reason: It’s a superheated blade-shaped plasma, which can cut through pretty much through anything (ok, except for cortosis, present at least in KotOR games). Why is there such a thing as closed door for me, again? Fair enough, some (especially in vital military installations etc.) would be covered with it, or an alloy (is “alloyed” a word?), but every bleedin’ door/wall/other across the whole galaxy? (even those seemingly made of wood?) If so, it’s no wonder we don’t see cortosis in the era… Read more »

nealithi
nealithi
1 year ago
Reply to  Dagroth

I think the HPs thing is a game issue. Because you should be instantly killed from lightsabre and and blaster hits too. I have not done anything with programming in decades (Wow it has been a while) But I assume there are some steep programming hurdles to put that kind of destruction into a game.
The only game(s) off the top of my head that could do it built in are Fallout and Outer Worlds. And Outer Worlds isn’t crazy with the limb loss.
Need more coffee to think this through.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 year ago
Reply to  Dagroth

“They’re uhh….wearing cortosis armor!” What, even that guy in black robes and nothing else? “….Yes” Interestingly enough the Way of the Samurai series played with the idea in a mode that’s usually unlockable where blade blows were instantly deadly (to you as well). I know Bushido Blade did that as well, but that was a fighting game, not an adventure/RPG game. The unfortunate issue was that they usually didn’t program in the necessary logic for story-important even NPCs to properly “lose” in scripted events where they don’t die. So you’d blow past their event trigger HP % and be stuck… Read more »

Devil-Arcana
Devil-Arcana
1 year ago

Considering all the blood and mangled body parts I have seen throughout my lifetime, game violence is super tame. I am a dad and I have no issue with my (5) kids seeing this sort of stuff. It may well harden them for what they may have to witness in their lifetimes.

Urazz
Urazz
1 year ago

Big thing is that chopping off a limb in most cases is not a fatal blow, especially since the wound is cauterized. The enemy can still fight or call for backup so it kind of makes sense we don’t see human limbs flying around since a slash to the torso is more likely to be fatal than a chopped off arm or leg. That’s not to say the human won’t be perfectly lucid and in good shape to fight, he/she will probably be in shock and/or pain but they should be able to fight back if left alone for long… Read more »

Alex
Alex
1 year ago

Tim, is this the first time you’ve depicted yourself with greying hair? If not, it’s the first time I’ve noticed. Been reading for well over a decade (since Zeke was first built).

And yes, all arms should fall off, not just droids. Dismember everything!

Ubertakter
1 year ago
Reply to  Tim

Right there with you, including the extra gray temples.

Deepak Menon
1 year ago

I loved the Kyle Katarn games on PC for that, by default there’s no dismemberment, but it was made by Raven Software (who made the first 2 Soldier of Fortune games) so you could enable it with a cheat code ๐Ÿ˜‰

Hunter
Hunter
1 year ago
Reply to  Deepak Menon

It was awesome how over the top it could get. The rag dolls would sometimes have all four limbs and the head fly off. For a young teenager, it was so beautiful.

Kenju
Kenju
1 year ago

At least older Star Wars games (Jedi Knight) gave a half assed explanation for this by having the enemies wearing cortosis armor, which (supposedly) is highly resistant to lightsabers (even if it is only supposed to work as a weave for vibroblades and not for armor). Still don’t understand why they don’t do something like the 90’s X-Men cartoon and just have your character use different attacks against living enemies than against droids since Jedi are supposed to be pacifist by nature…it’s not like that would be difficult to program in since ye Old Republic II had multiple Lightsaber styles… Read more »

ledman
ledman
1 year ago

I am 99% sure your lightsaber attacks could sever enemy limbs in both Jedi Outcast and Jedi Academy games. And their rating was fine.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 year ago
Reply to  ledman

It took a bit of simple resource file editing but yes, after a few variable changes stormtrooper limbs were flying all over the place.

Bob's Muff
Bob's Muff
1 year ago
Reply to  Kaitensatsuma

Or you could type in the cheat for it

EagleEye007
EagleEye007
1 year ago
Reply to  Kaitensatsuma

You could always sever arms in Jedi Academy without editing. If you wanted to lop off heads you had to make some changes to the files.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 year ago

I’m replaying Jedi Outcast and enjoying the fact that dismemberment can be modded in.

It’s just too bad that’s not the only thing that needs modding in this game. A Stormtrooper shouldn’t be able to take six laser blasts to the face yo.

Avidya
Avidya
1 year ago

I mean itโ€™s not really a *saber*…

Leon
Leon
1 year ago

Lightsabers are life savers

Dan
Dan
1 year ago

I clearly remember the first lightsaber “slice” (the cantina scene from Ep 4), had quite a lot of blood.

Deborah
1 year ago

Just going to drop a Because Science link here, because death by lightsaber as, well, various parts of your body EXPLODE would be much, much worse, and much more gory, than anything depicted in the films or in games: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRAyIXgWBWc

A more elegant weapon? I think I’ll stick with my clumsy, random blaster. From range. Where I won’t get exploded upon. *nods*

leduk
leduk
1 year ago
Reply to  Deborah

wow thanks for the link

Urazz
Urazz
1 year ago
Reply to  Deborah

If I recall in the Phantom Menace, when Darth Maul was cut in half through the torso by Obi-Wan Kenobi, we actually saw a mist of blood spray out and evaporate from Maul’s torso as he was cut in half.

BadW0lf
BadW0lf
1 year ago

Weirdly enough this comic makes me want to get Death Stranding. I have been a little unsure because of all of the WTF reviews. But this comic makes me think… maybe I should try it because I might love it.

Jim Campbell
Jim Campbell
1 year ago

Psst, if nobody’s mentioned it yet, I think you mean “discriminate” in the third bubble-ette of panel one.

Twilight Faze
1 year ago

I think that was answered in a comic: Cortosis weave. Like, that’s what Vader’s suit is made out of and it’s lightsaber-resistant. I can’t confirm it’s canon (mostly because I can’t be made to care enough to research it), but most soldiers in the Empire and Resistance have armor that’s made of the stuff because it can resist the lightsaber’s energy as you would steel armor to a sword. Head-canon states that when the Jedi were still around (before A New Hope), it was just standard equipment, hence why no limbs flying. But by the time A New Hope was… Read more »

Urazz
Urazz
1 year ago
Reply to  Twilight Faze

That and there is an ability in the force to absorb energy. We saw Vader absorb blaster bolts with his hand in Empire Strikes Back and in one of the SWTOR cinematics, Satele Shan actually prevented a lightsaber from stabbing her by absorbing the blade with her hands. She wasn’t able to do anything else but prevent the blade from stabbing her with the constant flow of energy though until Jace Malcom saved her ass.

Twilight Faze
1 year ago
Reply to  Urazz

Was that in the opening cinematics? Otherwise I don’t think I’m that far in the game yet. Good to know though!

Tinkergood
Tinkergood
1 year ago

Who remembers the “realistic lighsaber combat” cheat code from Jedi Knight and Jedi Academy where you don’t even need to swing your lightsaber, enemies got cut in half?

Bernie Margolis
Bernie Margolis
1 year ago

Just so you know what’s coming, the roles will reverse in about 10 years. Your kids will be constantly complaining about the lack of realism in games and anime, and you’ll be singing that refrain from MST3K:
Repeat to yourself, “It’s just a show. I should really just relax.”

Gwydion_Wolf
Gwydion_Wolf
1 year ago

Well, if anything, their keeping it true to the Movies in all aspects except for the severed arm in the Tantooin Canteena, and Lukes hand in Cloud City (the original ones anyway). Vader never really ‘hacked apart’ the Rebels on Leia’s Blockade Runner, and Luke / Obi One didnt hack off limbs of Sand-people or Storm-troopers (again, excluding the one incident in the Canteena). Yet both hacked to pieces mechanical things (droids, doors, power-conduits thrown across the room). So in That Aspect, their keeping it relatively the same. Though ya, As teenagers/kids, and even grown-ups, we all “know” what would… Read more »

Eldest Gruff
Eldest Gruff
1 year ago

Of course he’s not happy. Judging by his shirt, I’m guessing he’s about five minutes away from going online and complaining about Sword and Shield, just like all the other five-year-olds whining about the National Dex. -_-

Alex
Alex
1 year ago

How about Not BUYING ANYTHING FROM EA OR ACTIVISION INSTEAD? would that be so much to ask?

Eldest Gruff
Eldest Gruff
1 year ago
Reply to  Tim

Agreed. This game might actually be a return to “Challenge Everything” EA. It’s like dog training: reward good behavior.

Respawn did nothing wrong; however, I’m all for voting based on the game itself and not who did what. If Bioware were to make a terrible game in part due to EA (imagine!) I’m not going to support it just ’cause it’s Bioware.

Alex
Alex
1 year ago
Reply to  Tim

You people Never Learn. For people like you is why EA and Activision Still exist, you hope that someday they will change but they wont, they both have been killing studios for years but you people still believe in then, what it would take for you people to finally realise that Buying anything from EA is BAD and hurts the whole industry? I guess when the industry finally colapse, which wont happend since we have Japanese developers who dont commit to this kind of Crap.

TuffMelon
TuffMelon
1 year ago

They should have added an optional cheat or something for human dismemberment.
I remember Jedi Knight games had that as a console command.

Stef
Stef
1 year ago

My son grew up sitting on my lap as I played GTA5. They were both “released” about the same time.
The stuff he’s seen…
Thankfully he hasn’t once said the n-word.
But he does take a lot of glee in watching me powerslide through pedestrians…

SimplyMonk
SimplyMonk
1 year ago

Lightsabers were always scientifically flawed in numerous ways. Plasma does a lot of fun physics to organic materials that isn’t kid or even adult friendly. I kinda wish that George Lucas had made the lightsaber a weapon that is only useable by Jedi/Sith by them requiring the Force in order to shape and control the plasma of the blade. Would then be able to do a bunch of hand wavy stuff “because Force” instead of just hand waving at physics in general. Make the lightsaber something a Force Master gets to wield and not any punk with a free hand… Read more »

Lombardio
Lombardio
1 year ago

In every treatise I have seen on the ‘reality’ of lightsabers, the inevitable conclusion is that the wielder and everyone else nearby would instantly catch fire (or explode from rapid expansion) and die horrible, gruesome deaths from the intense energy output. The nerd in me screams about that every time I see a lightsaber used. Once I get past that for the sake of narrative and entertainment, I get over the limb thing.

Lilitha
Lilitha
1 year ago

If the reason was for kids, I am not sure why they couldn’t just have an option for it. A ton of games have gore options.

Malcrif
Malcrif
1 year ago

What’s your stance on Pokemon really being just a different type of Hatchimal?

DrG
DrG
1 year ago

Disney has Luke Skywalker himself call it a “Laser Sword”. They know nothing and cannot be trusted with the franchise. This game further it by allowing your “force meter” to increase as a result of aggressive actions – not exactly the path of the Jedi.

Expect more such nonsense in the future.

It was a good game though. Grumble. Mutter. Grudging acceptance.

Wumbo
Wumbo
1 year ago

Mabye stormtrooper armor is EXTREMELY heat resistant and has kickass insulation? I mean, they take friggin plasma bolts to the chest yet not a single round has yet to peirce their armor. It would be reasonable to assume plasma sticks would fare just as well.