24

Extra Credit

August 18, 2021 by Tim

There are so many games these days that I have a hard time keeping up with all the new ones I want to play each year, nevermind going back to previous releases. But I’ve been gaming so long that I got to play most of the big milestones as they were happening.

It saddens me to think of all the amazing games my kids will likely never experience, solely because the library of great titles vastly exceeds any reasonable schedule, especially as they want to keep on what’s new and current with their friends.

They’ll play some of the classics sure, but many other great moments will simply go unexplored. It’s like they were born with an impossible backlog right out of the gate.


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Guy Davidson
Guy Davidson
1 month ago

I still haven’t read Dune, and I’m 53…

Chris
Chris
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

You actually dare to admit that? I’d be ashamed if I were you 😉

DAT
DAT
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

I tried to read it (because it was in the scifi/fantasy section of my local library and I read EVERYTHING in those sections). Even book libraries were smaller back then.

Tried, because I hated it. And that’s odd, because the 1984 movie version is one of my all time favorites.

It sticks out even more, because it’s just one of two things that worked out so bad for me. The other is LOTR – I found even simarillion more interesting than the original books.

Laslo H
Laslo H
1 month ago
Reply to  DAT

Wow….that’s just weird.

David K.
David K.
1 month ago
Reply to  DAT

I enjoyed it but I can easily see the writing style not being for everyone. The movie tells the story in such a different way too so it’s not hard to imagine why you’d like one and not the other.

Robert Rooke
Robert Rooke
1 month ago
Reply to  DAT

Try The Name of the Wind if you like fantasy. Like Harry Potter, only the main is actually good with magic lol.

Lomedae
Lomedae
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

Not trying to be THAT guy, but I have been reading SF all my life and I can honestly say I have never recommended Dune to anyone, and think it is perhaps the most overrated classic around.

Cheuk
Cheuk
1 month ago
Reply to  Lomedae

Never recommend Dune the book series. Dune the first book however, is a pretty good classic read that I’d recommend to anybody already in the Sci-Fi scene.

Dune is definitely not an entry point Sci-Fi book.

Cygwulf
Cygwulf
1 month ago
Reply to  Cheuk

Very much agree with both of you. Dune is great, if the reader loves big, complex sci-fi and also likes big dramatic fantasy stories. But neither of those genre are for everyone

Al Capone's Ghost
Al Capone's Ghost
1 month ago
Reply to  Cheuk

The Night’s Dawn Trilogy by Peter F. Hamilton is, IMO, a far better read.

Sci-Fi. Space Ghosts. Various threads and arcs that actually LEAD SOMEHERE.

God I love that damn series.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 month ago
Reply to  Lomedae

The original was alright. A mix of Science Fiction, Fantasy, and Non-Fiction (For the mid 60’s) blended nicely

Last edited 1 month ago by Kaitensatsuma
wakeupgen
wakeupgen
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

Currently reading it now! As with any book, read till the 1/3rd point to give it a chance. That’s usually when the juicy action starts and Dune doesn’t disappoint. It’s like a shorter and more palatable Game of Thrones in space, so if you like political intrigue, armies colliding, and assassins, this is your book.

BENJAMIN SMITH
BENJAMIN SMITH
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

I only made it through Dune because of audiobooks. Good story and all, but reading gets hard life gets on with it.

Delapoire
Delapoire
1 month ago
Reply to  BENJAMIN SMITH

Me too, I’m glad I had somebody reading me through the denser parts XD

Mr_Meng
Mr_Meng
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

33 and still haven’t read LOTR. Personally, I find it boring. I know I know back to the stocks with me.

Michael
Michael
1 month ago
Reply to  Mr_Meng

You’re not wrong though; Tolkien’s writing style is dreadfully tedious.

Doodm4n
Doodm4n
1 month ago
Reply to  Mr_Meng

LOL Back to the stocks, enjoy the +1

Last edited 1 month ago by Doodm4n
Drew
Drew
1 month ago
Reply to  Guy Davidson

I’m on the third book of the series with 70 pages to go. (Children of Dune. Leto’s just gotten the sand trout attached to him.) They do have their payoff, but I understand. Frank Herbert is a bit difficult at times. Oh, and I’m 54, so right there with ya. I’m sure there’s books you’ve read that I haven’t.

foducool
foducool
1 month ago

Damn Tim, your kid isn’t gonna graduate before he’s 30

evilleet
evilleet
1 month ago

Looks like homeschooling could after all be a valid way to teach kids nowadays. 😀

FITCamaro
FITCamaro
1 month ago
Reply to  evilleet

Been a valid way for decades my friend.

evilleet
evilleet
1 month ago
Reply to  FITCamaro

You are right. When the parents are well versed in all topics needed, from Math, chemistry, history, languages, sports, art to physics.

But if they are, then it would be a waste to not teach others and get paid for it.
Most “home schooling” is done with religions bias afaik and there is only so much Jesus can teach us about science. 🙂

Nico de Boer
Nico de Boer
1 month ago

You’ve introduced your kid to Dr Who already?

Killiak
Killiak
1 month ago

Kids growing up with impossible backlogs?
That’s the best preparation for life they could ever get!

Paul
Paul
1 month ago

Watching my son play Roblox and I regret not keeping my old N64 so I could introduce him to the 3D platformers on there. Something about those classic consoles made games feel more accessible somehow, compared to the overcomplicated ones we have today.

We’ll always have Minecraft…

Kaogen
Kaogen
1 month ago
Reply to  Paul

Certainly helps that back then all you had to do (once the thing finally started up without the cartridge being dusty) was hit start and start playing. No accounts, launchers, settings to change for performance, etc etc.
The definition of plug and play, pretty much.

Alaris
Alaris
1 month ago
Reply to  Kaogen

To be fair, a lot of that has to do with PC Vs Console (Consoles tend to not have any accounts, performance settings, etc).

Frederic Simard
Frederic Simard
1 month ago
Reply to  Alaris

You haven’t touched a console in a long time, have you?

Jacob
Jacob
1 month ago
Reply to  Alaris

Those settings exist on console even if you don’t dig into the menu to find them. Everything from gamma level to HDMI alignment to sprites (at least on Xbox where things play across multiple hardware platforms) are adjustable.

My LCD is dark enough (12 years old at this point) that I bump the gamma on almost every game I touch.

The Schaef
The Schaef
1 month ago
Reply to  Paul

Still have all of my (functioning) consoles, going back to the N64 and the GBA.

For anything older than that I typically suggest my kids sit down and have themselves a nice slice of raspberry pie.

raven0ak
raven0ak
1 month ago
Reply to  Paul

some bit more modern ones I can though recommend: a hat in time (this is essentially all of best of best parts of golden era of 3d collectaton platformers combined into one), ductales remastered (graphically uplifted old nes era classic) ,and old classics: disney afternoon collection (rest of capcoms disney games on nes), commander keen complete pack (all of keen games), humongous entertainment collection (all of 80’s/90’s point and clicks of theirs)

Dom
Dom
1 month ago
Reply to  Paul

Don’t worry. We lose Minecraft too as the go-to game one day. But only to something as great as Minecraft, but for the next technological leap.

Bwauder
Bwauder
1 month ago

I have fond memories of Knights of Legend (circa 1993 approx), you can still get it for free as abandonware, but its horrible, clunky and virtually unplayable when compared to whats available now. In its prime there wasn’t much to challenge it, a complex system years ahead of its time for training and classes, and an open world (ish, again good then). I invested way too many hours and finished it several times as different characters but now unless someone goes in with an iron will, they’ll likely have given up and be playing something else within 30 minutes or… Read more »

deeketr
deeketr
1 month ago

Not that old, but in 5 to 10 years they will be irrelevant.
Dead Space and Bioshock (the first one). Absolutely fantastic games that many gamers will never touch.

Last edited 1 month ago by deeketr
The Schaef
The Schaef
1 month ago
Reply to  deeketr

My oldest has already played Bioshock, and Human Revolution.

They’ve had a crash course in the classics and I think that makes them a little more receptive to games across and between eras. My two oldest, for example, have played many a Zelda; one’s favorite is Majora’s Mask, while another really liked Minish Cap.

With that said, at the end of the day, the one game that all of them kind of rally around is Minecraft. Or Smash. Or Duck Game.

lechuckGL
lechuckGL
1 month ago
Reply to  The Schaef

It’s funny but Bioshock still holds up really well in terms of gameplay and graphics. Sure: we’ve come a long way but it shows you that most of the updates from the last years were purely aesthetic and not with a lot of substance.

Kasaix
Kasaix
1 month ago

“They’ll play some of the classics sure, but many other great moments will simply go unexplored. It’s like they were born with an impossible backlog right out of the gate.”

That’s true. So many milestone games, epic releases that changed the gaming landscape, will likely go unplayed by newer gamers in favor of Minecraft and Fortnite.

The Schaef
The Schaef
1 month ago
Reply to  Kasaix

They might have been, if Nintendo had taken their virtual console lineup seriously. They’re the only player in the industry with literally a 40-year back catalog, and my kids don’t even touch the service because they’re not particularly interested in playing NES Baseball or VICE: Project Doom. Meanwhile, Nintendo will charge you 60 bucks for the privilege of playing the old 3D Marios, and if you don’t already have the collection, I’m pretty sure it’s too late now.

Kasaix
Kasaix
1 month ago
Reply to  The Schaef

Oh yeah, it’s definitely on them. Their virtual console could do so much to keep their old games alive, but they almost refuse to do it.

Lily
Lily
1 month ago

I am really into games, always have been but I never had any of the playstations or an xbox. After the nes, I got all the sega consoles then went solely into pc gaming. I don’t even think most gamers get all the different gaming consoles, and there are always exclusives.

The Schaef
The Schaef
1 month ago
Reply to  Lily

The last non-Nintendo console I bought was a Playstation 2.

Eldest Gruff
Eldest Gruff
1 month ago
Reply to  The Schaef

You missed out on a lot. Not necessarily in the last gen, but 360/PS3 was amazing.

ParanoidNutcase
ParanoidNutcase
1 month ago

I think Nostalgia colors the lenses for 99% of these classics. Sure, they were 100% super innovative and fantastic *at the time* and thats how you remember them, but most games generally take the good and leave the bad from the past. Far from all, but games industry innovates. For every Dues Ex theres a dozen games like Goldeneye that’s only good in memory and becomes a trash fire the second you try to play it.

Vadim
Vadim
1 month ago

Came here for this.
Most of gamers are really better off playing modern or at least pretty recent releases than to explore something extremely old. Games nowadays are great. Everything that makes you happy in the very moment you are playing – is great.

If we insist on learning “classics” – do it on youtube, with good narration and explanations why it was good. If it’ll spark the interest – the game will be played.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 month ago
Reply to  Vadim

Not sure how much enjoyment you’re going to get out of watching someone else play Sonic 3 or Mario 64

Oh sure, I even still listen to “Metal Gear Solid 1/2/3 the Movie” and the Legacy of Kain series of games formatted as a movie on Youtube while I work but those are consolidated 2-4 hour videos

lechuckGL
lechuckGL
1 month ago

Maybe. But take Doom for example: even older than Goldeneye and it’s still fun to play and holds up really well. Yes: it is true that many games are no longer enjoyable due to technological limitation, but many others manage to overcome that gap because their mechanics are still 100% valid.

Bizze
Bizze
1 month ago
Reply to  lechuckGL

It’s important to remember that Doom actually wouldn’t hold up well at all – if you played in its original release format on DOS. With its minimal mouse aiming and lack of modern features, it’s a horrible experience. It’s only really the modern source ports that essentially create a modern game with ’93 graphics that hold it back up to today. If something like Goldeneye were to receive such a source port, it would likewise hold up better today.

Last edited 1 month ago by Bizze
lechuckGL
lechuckGL
1 month ago
Reply to  Bizze

I think that the simplistic controls is what makes the original Doom work as a FPS. Goldeneye feels clunky compared to modern shooters, Doom it’s just a whole different thing that plays differently.

David K.
David K.
1 month ago
Reply to  lechuckGL

IMO GoldenEye was great BECAUSE of the control limitations. Later games became so precise and over controlled that unless you sink hours upon hours into them you get slaughtered. The skill curve in GoldenEye was much more forgiving and thus allowed mediocre and great players to still have fun together.

raven0ak
raven0ak
1 month ago
Reply to  lechuckGL

I’d say portal 1 hold quite well, original half-life does too likely (albeit bit lesser extend)

Soag
Soag
1 month ago

Dude, not so long ago I played the first Tomb Raider for the first time and it was really fun. Level design in this game was REALLY good. And I actually plan to play through all of TR titles. Similar story with Max Payne and #1 & #2 both were exceptional. I’ll admit nostalgia factor is a thing for many of the titles but it’s not like old games were trash and that 99% ratio is a definite exaggeration. I can think of so many titles which were good then and would still be a blast now (although the fact… Read more »

The_rAt
The_rAt
1 month ago

Innovation is definitely a valid point, but it’s also important to consider that industries also regress and stagnate to fit the lowest common denominator over time. Look at the movie industry – their entire business model is based on risk-avoidance, so the drive is essentially to make the exact same movies over and over again with just enough tweaks to that it can be marketed as different. This has been going on in the gaming industry for quite some time (see EA, mobile gaming, etc), so it needs to be said that newer does not equate better. This is compounded… Read more »

The_rAt
The_rAt
1 month ago

One other thing I wanted to mention about older games – not to sound like an old man, but there’s a character-building element, too. While this is absolutely not true for all games, the overall is trend very much towards the lowest common denominator – either by making the game easier, shorter or offering work-arounds (or pay to win model) all to cater towards the expectation of instant gratification. That’s a poor life skill to take out into the world, and unchecked, I do think it can contribute to (not cause, mind you, but definitely contribute to) an overall viewpoint… Read more »

Scott
Scott
1 month ago
Reply to  The_rAt

I think this is a significant exaggeration at best. Classic games were meant to appeal to all ages, which meant they needed to be a challenge for all ages, which meant a number of classic games are really freaking hard, especially in the end levels. Trying the end levels in Mario 1 over and over and over again was not a worthy use of time, and it didn’t “build character” no matter what Calvin’s dad would say. Games are supposed to be fun entertainment that helps one relax at the end of a hard day, not rites of passage that… Read more »

Scott
Scott
1 month ago
Reply to  Scott

Sorry, I should clarify that I am not defending pay to win or shorter games, but I think having easier difficulties available to choose from is much better than the old way, as it allows games to appeal to a significantly wider audience. My parents, in their seventies, are able to play Mario Kart with their grandchildren because Nintendo added the auto-drive and turning assistance. Players only select easier options if they want to use them. If developers want to put in “Story Mode” or “Easy Mode” and it allows more players to enjoy playing the game, then I see… Read more »

DanVzare
1 month ago

While I do agree with you, I think it’s closer to 80% not 99%. I find that a lot of old games that I’ve never played before in my life, are better than a lot of the really popular AAA modern games. No doubt because those same popular modern games will also eventually fall into that 80% of games that didn’t age well. It all depends on the game really. But like you said, for every Deus Ex, there’s a dozen Goldeneyes. By the way, I couldn’t agree more with those examples, they’re perfect. I couldn’t play Goldeneye for a… Read more »

The Schaef
The Schaef
1 month ago

Yeah, I can’t even play the original MGS anymore, I only play the Twin Snakes version.

Ronnie
Ronnie
1 month ago

Is it good or bad that just looking at the picture I knew exactly what game and what spot you were at and immediately heard the music?

nealithi
nealithi
1 month ago

Personally I love the child’s comment about the TV. Because I have gotten to see the really old TV’s with the huge from magnifier to a tiny screen in a huge box full of tubes. You see that and compare it to a modern television and you can be amazed at the technology evolution.

Kaogen
Kaogen
1 month ago

The harder to acquire old library of games is why It irritates me how hard some publishers push to prevent emulations. Like we were somehow able to buy it legitimately or something? They abandoned the titles to vanish into nothingness, they could at least be decent enough to let the players keep them around.

Last edited 1 month ago by Kaogen
Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 month ago
Reply to  Kaogen

Or do what Sega has done and literally release an emulator on Steam and charge $1~$5 per game 😄

Pulse
Pulse
1 month ago
Reply to  Kaitensatsuma

oh? whats it called? that sounds like a decent business model and a fair pricing.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 month ago
Reply to  Pulse

Sega Mega Drive and Genesis Classics

Me-me
Me-me
1 month ago

Video games are experiencing now what movies experienced fifty years ago, and what books experienced some … oh, a thousand years ago? Spoken word stories several millenia ago.

There is now more content that is worth consuming than can ever be reasonably consumed. That means one must, for purely practical reasons, select by taste, accessibility, social reasons, price.

It’s just the way of creative works. I would love to be knowledgeable about every webcomic, but it’s just not gonna happen.

DanVzare
1 month ago
Reply to  Me-me

Yeah, but you can at least try.
Every now and again, I discover an entirely new library of games I had no idea existed, all in my pursuit of trying to be knowledgeable about every game. My most recent discovery are what I essentially call Japanese B-games. My previous discovery were boardgames.

It might seem like those two things are fairly obvious, which was the exact reason it took me so long to discover them. The rabbit-holes are deep man. I’ve barely touched the surface and already have an overwhelming knowledge on them!

Scott
Scott
1 month ago
Reply to  DanVzare

This is Yakuza for me. Last year during furlough I played Yakuzo 0 on a whim, and it blew me away. Played 4 of the games over the next couple months, loved every minute of it.

Dorander
Dorander
1 month ago

I get the feeling. You want to give your kid the same wonderful experiences you had with these titles, growing up.

However I’m pretty sure kids will have their own wonderful experiences with modern titles, and that this is what happened to us too. I still recall my dad talking about some of the early games of his age, most of which I never got around to trying, and the ones that did… didn’t evoke the same feelings for me as they did for him.

Jesse
Jesse
1 month ago
Reply to  Dorander

To add to this, pretty much all the worthy classic games have been ported to newer systems, like Sonic to Playstation and Mario/Zelda to Switch. While it would be fun for all of the games from my childhood to be available, I don’t think my kids are REALLY missing out that much if they don’t get to play General Chaos, or Vectorman, or Bonk from the Turbo Grafx 16. And who are we kidding, in terms of visuals and overall experience, how can any classic game hold a candle to the great cinematic adventures like God of War and Bioshock?… Read more »

Kenju
Kenju
1 month ago

“How is this tv so small and so big at the same time?”
Oof, that takes me back right there lol

The_rAt
The_rAt
1 month ago

At least you’re on making progress, if you’re on the SNES era. Which brings me to an important question – did you save yourself some energy by going the Super Mario Allstars route or go for true authenticity and do the early Mario in their original NES glory?
(I say this knowing not everyone considers Mario’s 1-3 classics, but for my thoughts they’re essential learning)

Margaret Ann
Margaret Ann
1 month ago

As someone who is part of several retro gaming/randomizing communities…yup.

Kaitensatsuma
Kaitensatsuma
1 month ago

The minor blessing is that while the SNES/Genesis/PS1/PS2/Dreamcast/N64 generations were iconic and impossible to justify missing out on, after that things have…consolidated.

There just aren’t quite as many games of the caliber and creativity anymore. There still occasionally are, of course, just not nearly as frequently.

The_rAt
The_rAt
1 month ago
Reply to  Kaitensatsuma

There was definitely a point of diminishing returns. Originally, I think it was driven by developers trying to keep up with the advances in hardware while (in many cases, anyway) developing each game for 2-3 consoles, but pay-to-win, mobile gaming and DLC have been definite contributors to the climate, to name a few.

Novascourge
Novascourge
1 month ago
Reply to  Kaitensatsuma

I heavily disagree, especially on the PS1 and PS2 era. The PS1 had just shy of 8000 games released for it in it’s lifespan.

There are literally mountains of shovelware for those systems. For every FF7 or Metal Gear Solid or crash Bandicoot, there were 3 dozen terrible games that nobody liked or wanted.

The same is for the NES. There’s a reason AVGN existed. Because there were so many shitty NES and SNES games.

DanVzare
1 month ago

If you narrow down the list to the absolute classics (Super Mario Bros, Street Fighter II, Final Fantasy VII, ect), use savestates and fastforwarding, and narrowing your list even more by only finishing the games that require it (FF7) and just playing the ones that don’t (SF2), you can easily get an entire forty years worth of gaming knowledge within a year. Throw in a few Youtube reviews for good measure, and you’re as good as gold. The real hard part is trying to catch up with all of the obscure gems you and everyone else have missed. I’ve managed… Read more »

Evan
Evan
1 month ago

Ah the good old heavy bulb tv takes me back…. (Cue Vietnam style flashbacks)

Xanthicirs
Xanthicirs
1 month ago

I’d say have them beat one game per generation but I’d let them skip NES.

Dom
Dom
1 month ago

Think back to every great Atari-era game etc most of our generation (I’m a early 90’s kid) never played also. I had a life goal to play every game in my steam library, then I never did it, despite having no job. I had a life goal to collect every game ROM ever created (unfinished/non-released games excluded) and store it on hard drives, then I realized that it wouldn’t give me happiness even if I had collected everything I wanted to have. Life isn’t meant to be a hunt for 100% completing achievements. It took me until age 30 (this… Read more »

Pulse
Pulse
1 month ago

there just is something about playing snes games on a crt that is lost playing them on flatscreens

BPJ
BPJ
1 month ago

Wait until that moment you catch him playing ET

Tyler Pembroke
Tyler Pembroke
1 month ago

Parenting done right.

Vedrit
Vedrit
1 month ago

Many of the big games from the past 5 years or so (few as they are) and going forward into the foreseeable future will only be accessible to kids in the future by way of news articles, screnshots, videos, and wikipedia, because they’re all games-as-a-service. Once they close down, there’s no way to experience them.

Devil_Arcana
Devil_Arcana
1 month ago

So much truth here…

Christopher M Spooner
Christopher M Spooner
1 month ago

This reminds me of this talk/Article:
https://vimeo.com/129509636
https://medium.com/message/playing-with-my-son-e5226ff0a7c3

He forced his kid to play through games chronologically results:
The kid now loved brutally hard lo-fi games and is damned good at them.

MRD
MRD
1 month ago

Link to the Past! /glee

leduk
leduk
1 month ago

Even I dont enjoy old games anymore, I dont even have the time for new games. My daughter is playing botw and that’s very good.

Xsploit
Xsploit
1 month ago

the social aspect in gaming has always been huge though, even in our time pre internet, we still talked about those games at school and such, other than a parent who is the child going to talk about the game with? without the social aspect the game becomes less interesting

Verdiekus
Verdiekus
1 month ago

Lmfao, good luck Tim. That’s a homework assignment I’d happily redo if I had the time.

Maelwys
Maelwys
1 month ago

I think it’s a bit like music – artists were recording tracks long before we were born. Their tracks were colored by their era and limited by the technology of their time; there were good ones and bad ones and mediocre ones and they all evoke a certain amount of fond nostalga from those who heard them “back in the day”. Sometimes the better tracks get newer cover versions made, and the originals might get discussed and played on the radio from time to time. But how likely is it that a teenager these days is going to go out… Read more »

Jesse
Jesse
1 month ago

As a funny side note, I actually went through a bit of a gap between new games recently, and I decided to beat Link to the Past for the first time on my Switch. Took 2-3 weeks, but I did it. I thought it would feel like a bigger accomplishment, but alas, it’s nice to say I’ve beaten it.

Crestlinger
Crestlinger
1 month ago

If this is a retro gaming starting point the puzzles should be interesting.
If it was myself I would pick 2-3 from each genre and see what they like, then expand based on that. There is Plenty to choose from, main thing with all games is to have Fun.