24

The Campaign: Heavy Lifting

April 27, 2022 by Tim


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Gonfrask
Gonfrask
7 months ago

Well, now find a shrine, a cleric and hope to have gold or diamonds enough to pay for the service

ReaverRogue
ReaverRogue
7 months ago
Reply to  Gonfrask

Welp, they -are- walking out of this cave with a ton of goodies already. Looks like they’ll have to be poor a little while longer!

Gonfrask
Gonfrask
7 months ago
Reply to  ReaverRogue

Well, I can imagine a (very much evil and done by an even eviler DM) scenario where the only shrine with a resurected is lead by a “not so altruistic” priest, and well, you know…one have to eat, if you find something better tell me, and you should hurry, your friend is starting to stink

Humsterr
Humsterr
7 months ago

I find the most disappointing the way the character died.
I mean, if a character went out in an epic battle protecting the realm? Sure, he can stay dead, it is a great story. But what we have here, dying after the unfortunate fall (of dice), has to be changed

Interesting to see whether Three makes a temp or just remains DM only for the duration of the quest

Last edited 7 months ago by Humsterr
Humsterr
Humsterr
7 months ago
Reply to  Humsterr

And again I’d like to note how good at storytelling Tim got. All four equally participated in Tobyn’s death, while the flow of the story was completely natural, every character did what he/she would do

Bakhtosh
Bakhtosh
7 months ago
Reply to  Humsterr

Perfectly balanced, as all things should be.

Robfather
Robfather
7 months ago
Reply to  Humsterr

This same situation happened to me, basically.

Playing 5e, Dragonborn Fighter, ready for anything. Except dex saves across rickety bridges. Failed three in a row, last one was a natural 1. Nobody to blame but my dice.

GeorgeV
GeorgeV
7 months ago
Reply to  Robfather

That might be true, but don’t forget to think. Who or what caused you to roll those dice specifically? Did you handcraft them yourself, or did your enemies perhaps conspire to put them in your hands, knowing they would fail you at that critical moment?

Eldest Gruff
Eldest Gruff
7 months ago
Reply to  GeorgeV

Any neigh-omnipotent enemy who has the foresight to reach across the dimensions and plant magical fate-altering dice on an unsuspecting roleplayer, yet does not have the presence of mind to pull the trigger when the heroes are slaughtering their Minions of Darkness, but only afterwards when the heroes are hauling out their stuff, isn’t a very good Big Bad of a campaign.

Eldest Gruff
Eldest Gruff
7 months ago
Reply to  Tim

I’d love to blame autocorrect, but nope, that’s just me being stupid. 😀

Merendel
Merendel
7 months ago
Reply to  Eldest Gruff

Don’t worry its funnier this way.

robloughrey
robloughrey
7 months ago
Reply to  Tim

Bad Hose, Bad Horse, The thoroughbred of ones, He got the saving throw you just got done…

VibrantEvolution
VibrantEvolution
7 months ago
Reply to  Humsterr

unfortunately people can die in unheroic ways… When I play a game (like Tomb Raider or something) and I die I think damn… what will happen to the world now there’s nobody to stop the bad guys…
and it is like that. What if the hero just dies in a really stupid way. Slip down a cliff or miss a jump or the rope snaps or you really really just run out of flares in a dark cave…
It sucks but yeah it is not impossible for a character to die in this way…

Smol Bear
Smol Bear
7 months ago

You folks should try playing Call of Cthulu. Avoidable, anticlimactic deaths are omnipresent

GraySkye
GraySkye
7 months ago
Reply to  Smol Bear

Played Cthulu, finished multiple cases. No deaths (On the players end)

TomB
TomB
7 months ago
Reply to  Humsterr

Games are not stories. There is a story (or a series of them), but the fact we use rules that can kill a character means that the story may not unfold as we imagine. Those from OSR roots often feel that the lesson you need to absorb is: If you make any mistake it can kill you. And that if you make no mistakes, bad luck and a harsh universe can kill you. Adventuring is not for the faint of heart. It does hurt when a long held character dies because of a failed die roll. But for the extent… Read more »

Erin
Erin
7 months ago

I mean if you’re gonna run a leap across a chasm as just a bunch of checks, you have to accept that an embarrassing, ignominious death is in the realm of possibility.

I mean, where’s the agency? There’s no real choice here except “I try to pull myself out”, or fall.

Lily
Lily
7 months ago

He should feel guilty, since it is mostly his fault, for knocking him in and for not casting feather fall. Mostly for not casting feather fall.

ThatMageGuy
ThatMageGuy
7 months ago
Reply to  Lily

As a universalist “spell for every situation” wizard, I agree. Two forgot he prepped Slow Fall because it didn’t have anything to do with fire.

He murdered Tobyn -and shamed the class.-

Shame, shame.

Vukodlak
Vukodlak
7 months ago

Anyone still want to make the argument he still deserves and extra share simply for carrying the loot?

Marcus
Marcus
7 months ago

and then they all started praying to tobyn’s deity of choice whom swiftly smites each of them (not too harshly) taking some hp from each to gift back to tobyn.

Paula
Paula
7 months ago

Yes! Carry the body to a temple and pay whatever they want. I want Tobyn back!
Seriously, I love this storytelling…and I hate to lose RPG characters.

Dagroth
Dagroth
7 months ago

That’s why I prefer to play diceless (or mostly diceless) storytelling games, where the character won’t die because of bad rolls, with players being unable to do anything about it. (for the record, that’s not a complaint about the story) Nasty things, with dying included, can still happen, but usually as a result of players’ decisions. Or if they were planned as part of the story, but (as a GM) not -too- nasty in this case (assuming players have no way to prevent/influence it). Or in some cases, if arranged with one of the players (in that case, other players… Read more »

Last edited 7 months ago by Dagroth
Cyrad
Cyrad
7 months ago

I’m sure Batman would have been able to save him.

A shame somebody didn’t let Batman join the party.

Dagroth
Dagroth
7 months ago
Reply to  Cyrad

One’s attempt at Batman once joined it. He put all his points into Charisma stat, was all dark, brooding… and nearly useless. So, he wouldn’t be able to. (I tried to find that comic, but don’t remember, when it was posted, and searching for “Batman” returned a lot of results with regular Batman, not the one I was looking for)

Last edited 7 months ago by Dagroth
Dagroth
Dagroth
7 months ago
Reply to  Dagroth

Can’t edit anymore, but I managed to find the beginning of that story: https://cad-comic.com/comic/the-campaign-crypt/

GeorgeV
GeorgeV
7 months ago
Reply to  Dagroth

True, but that was only his second attempt. Cyrad is referring to One’s original character, on the first page of The Campaign. The one he was forced to abandon in favor of Not-Batman the Rib Crusher.

Dagroth
Dagroth
7 months ago
Reply to  GeorgeV

Ah, that one. I didn’t remember it, the other one was more memorable. 😉

Last edited 7 months ago by Dagroth
I prefer secrecy
I prefer secrecy
7 months ago
Reply to  Cyrad

On the other hand. Robert O’Cop might not have been able to make that jump.

Pulse
Pulse
7 months ago

awww they love you so much 3. totally not them feeling bad for each having a hand in your death.

Humsterr
Humsterr
7 months ago

Ironic how they can revive themselves faster than an RPG character

Eldest Gruff
Eldest Gruff
7 months ago

This is a surprising amount of wholesomeness, care, and support from a group of four people who routinely murder each other IRL.

foducool
foducool
7 months ago

it was a group effort XD

Bakhtosh
Bakhtosh
7 months ago

Wouldn’t a high level cleric be…not due…but likely to receive a bit of divine intervention? Even if it’s just a messenger of the deity giving the party a quest…

Joel
Joel
7 months ago
Reply to  Bakhtosh

Roll for the save on that one. Critical fail: A messenger from the deity’s enemy arrives to finish him off.

Scarymother
Scarymother
7 months ago

GM shouldn’t be playing a key character anyway.

Scarymother
Scarymother
7 months ago
Reply to  Tim

It’s not.

I sincerely hope that your GMs aren’t playing PCs in your campaigns. And if you’re the GM and you’re doing that, it’s a disservice to your players.

GraySkye
GraySkye
7 months ago
Reply to  Scarymother

Well my players love my characters when I GM. the trick is playing them right. Heavily useful without stealing the spot light.

Scarymother
Scarymother
7 months ago
Reply to  GraySkye

You’re stealing experiences from them.

Last edited 7 months ago by Scarymother
Dagroth
Dagroth
7 months ago
Reply to  Scarymother

He’s hardly a key character, though. I believe we once had a similiar discussion with Tim, and he said something about, that’s why GM is playing a cleric, mostly a support character, so that he doesn’t end up solving the problems for others.

I think I wouldn’t do that (as a GM), as it might be tricky to separate the ideas a character might get from those I would (separating the knowledge would be easier, I think), but if Three can pull it off, more power to him.

Scarymother
Scarymother
7 months ago
Reply to  Dagroth

I should have said “PC” instead of “key character”

The cleric is clearly a Player Character (as opposed to an NPC) as it is involved in conversations.

No. Not more power to him. The GM PC is doing things that a player should be doing.

Scarymother
Scarymother
7 months ago
Reply to  Tim

I’m glad I’ve never had a GM that tried. Thinking that you can without cheapening the players’ experience is plain hubris.

Achievements are lessened and means the players are being robbed of activities.

Also it creates unnecessarily weird situations where the GM PC would go quiet while the GM was doing what the GM was supposed to be doing.

Clearly we have no common ground on this discussion, so we may as well call it quits.

Keep up the good work on the comics.

Scarymother
Scarymother
7 months ago
Reply to  Scarymother

Just one additional thought: if you think that a GM-run PC is necessary for the group, how about letting them use henchmen or hirelings to fill the gaps in their group instead?

Urazz
Urazz
7 months ago

Well, no bonding like team bonding as a result of the entire team killing a teammate with incompetence.

Scortch
Scortch
7 months ago

Wow this is a really rare moment of compassion from 2. Usually the players are gouging each other.

dokoboe
dokoboe
7 months ago

I had something similar happen in one of my recent campaigns, and we resolved the loss by having the cleric’s god raise him as a hollow one as payment for loyalty, so Blyn the ravager, scourge of the underdark and lord of the mighty pyres of hermic is now Blyn the reborn.

unchecked
unchecked
7 months ago

i like 4’s comment the most

mcjstar
mcjstar
7 months ago

Yeah, I mean I get this for story purposes this makes great comedy, but if you have ever played, this situation just SUCKS. And there are definitely some flaws in this. One, tossing the bag down should not have been a roll of any sort. That’s micromanaging things and the bag could have just been tossed down and picked up without any rolls, and then used to stabilize him. Two, you get to make more death saving throws than just 1. You have to roll three success or three failures. If you botch it’s still only 2 and you still… Read more »

GraySkye
GraySkye
7 months ago
Reply to  mcjstar

Your basing this on what system? The campaign isn’t a set system, its a multi quasi based game with similarities to some systems. As already mentioned by Tim on yesterdays post. In Pathfinder 2e, if you critically fail Administering First Aid, you increase your target’s dying value by 1. If you take damage while dying, it goes up by one. If you fail your recovery roll, it goes up by one. If you reach 4, you’re dead. Tobyn Falling due to Flizwit’s “help” Tobyn getting smacked in the face with Cake’s 25lb metal traps Tobyn failing his own recovery roll… Read more »

mcjstar
mcjstar
7 months ago
Reply to  GraySkye

I base off D&D 5e, but yeah I get that a system isn’t really stated for their game. However your incidents are still flawed. Falling is the thing that put him at dying, so your first point is null since he hadn’t fallen yet. Cake’s bag should not have counted. As I said in my first post, the bag should have been tossed down and it shouldn’t have been made to hit him in the head. There was no need to make that happen or to force a roll for it to not happen. OK, so now two death saves… Read more »

GraySkye
GraySkye
7 months ago
Reply to  mcjstar

Umm… Tim, the guy who made the comic, posted those, not me. That is not my logic, that is the guy who wrote this logic. He is the GM in this story, its his choice what to do. Sure Cake could have dropped it further away but if her intent was to drop it as close to the Barbarian as possible to save precious time, then that was the character choice. Players (Both IRL and in the Comic) Don’t always go for the ‘logical’ solution. Look back at the orb and staff puzzle, those are the people your speaking about… Read more »

Alcor
Alcor
7 months ago

To be serious for a moment, this is why I almost never have character death in the games I GM. It’s way more fun to have your character suffer some grisly but nonlethal fate or trauma or such, than to just be like “nope, you’re dead, sucks for your personal narrative and character development.”

GraySkye
GraySkye
7 months ago
Reply to  Alcor

depends on the game and how its done. As part of a TPK I have had the party get captured, their secondary plebs did a mission to save them. I have played with a GM who craply fudged the die after the fact just so he didn’t drop one of my characters. Dwarf was attacked by an orc which happened to hit, took my last few HP away to drop me dying, GM ‘Oh, that didn’t happen, you still have X HP left’. I mean, whats the point in a fantasy game full of adventure without danger? I like the… Read more »

joefuck
joefuck
6 months ago

Seems like Three is a pretty bad GM. Guilt-tripping their players into abandoning a quest for them to revive their favourite NPC is such a weird vain move.